Jon Katz

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home studio vs pro studio recording

Feb 1, 2013·30 visitors

Blake Ian

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Stage· 166 messages

Feb 1, 2013

Blake Ian · 7:57 PM

Yo dude

Jon Katz · 7:59 PM

hey man

Blake Ian · 7:59 PM

Good topic... Let's Tawk recording

Jon Katz · 8:01 PM

like myself you have been in the home, and pro studio environments. where do you see the major differences?

Blake Ian · 8:03 PM

Well we came along at an interesting time... We were teenage musicians when the 4 tracks started getting out there... and the year I began Music Production at Purchase, was RIGHT when Pro Tools came out with the 001

Blake Ian · 8:03 PM

So the differences since then have become less... BUT of course there are still many advantages to pro studio

Blake Ian · 8:04 PM

1 being just the experience in general. Meaning, not you are hiring someone, you don't have to worry about Saving, backing up, setting up gear... you can relax and be "the artist"

Blake Ian · 8:05 PM

thats can make a huge difference in the results you get... but of course for the same exact reasons there is an intimacy and intensity to home recording that you don't get from Pro

Jon Katz · 8:09 PM

very true. when i was at school PT was not much more then copy and paste, our "digital studio" was an analog Trident recording to 3 ADAT's

Blake Ian · 8:09 PM

ADATs!

Blake Ian · 8:09 PM

Blake Ian · 8:10 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADAT

Jon Katz · 8:13 PM

not being the artist in a pro environment, but the engineer made for a huge contrast. i took for granted the amazing mic closet we had for example.

Jon Katz · 8:13 PM

the room treatment for tracking is another.

Jon Katz · 8:13 PM

now, with my home studio i had to make my mixing room my tracking room as well.

Blake Ian · 8:13 PM

absolutely room treatment is key.... but again, there is a random unique effect about the home studio...

Blake Ian · 8:14 PM

I remember putting pillows and blankets in front of my G4 tower because of the fan noise!

Blake Ian · 8:14 PM

lol

Blake Ian · 8:14 PM

BUT, I have to say there is some beautiful noise that happens too, happy accidents

Jon Katz · 8:14 PM

haha i just ordered new silent fans for my power conditioner!

Blake Ian · 8:15 PM

sweet

Blake Ian · 8:15 PM

for instance, John Frusciante's first record is on a 4 track in a basement

Jon Katz · 8:15 PM

like i said, im tracking in my mixing room =)

Blake Ian · 8:15 PM

and there are some "artifacts" that happen BECAUSE of the uncontrolled environment

Jon Katz · 8:15 PM

as was the police!

Jon Katz · 8:15 PM

yes, which all add to the "sound"

Blake Ian · 8:15 PM

Sublime 40 oz to Freedom!

Jon Katz · 8:16 PM

yep!

Blake Ian · 8:16 PM

so when you are in a completely controlled environment... everything that gets down on "tape" has to be created.

Blake Ian · 8:16 PM

as opposed to letting the atmosphere get in on the creative process and be your co-producer :)

Jon Katz · 8:17 PM

agreed, its interesting i find myself more overly critical of my mixes at home, then in a pro studio.

Blake Ian · 8:17 PM

also there is the time thing too, I have worked with in some very friendly pro environments, but at the end of the day it is still someone's time... and when it's you at home, time doesn't exist.

Blake Ian · 8:18 PM

Well yes it's hard to not be overly critical when it's all in your hands right?

Blake Ian · 8:18 PM

like most things it's a less stressful process to delegate and let go of control of elements

Blake Ian · 8:19 PM

Again though I cannot seem to come to a preference, or a "better"

Blake Ian · 8:19 PM

both have ups and downs

Blake Ian · 8:19 PM

the excitement of being in a room where greats have played is always nice!

Blake Ian · 8:19 PM

and so is recording the song 5 feet from your bed that you wrote it on

Jon Katz · 8:21 PM

most definitely!

Jon Katz · 8:21 PM

i have to say being at electric lady a few times you had that feeling

Blake Ian · 8:22 PM

Nice what did you record there?

Jon Katz · 8:24 PM

its what drove me out of the studio =) an 80's rock band that we had to record line for line and analog pitch shift the vocals.

Jon Katz · 8:24 PM

that was one of the first times i realized somestimes you have to ignore the music hehe

Jon Katz · 8:25 PM

i did like working with tape though

Jon Katz · 8:26 PM

i sometimes want to buy a teac off ebay jut to play around.

Jon Katz · 8:28 PM

another huge difference is outboard gear vs all "in the box" effects

Blake Ian · 8:29 PM

Yes effects is a huge plus

Blake Ian · 8:29 PM

the fact that a studio is budgeting to make hundreds of records and a home is budgeted to make a few

Blake Ian · 8:29 PM

changes the game a bit for sure

Jon Katz · 8:30 PM

i love my tube-tech cl 1b compressor plug-in, but actually using the real compressor not the model is huge

Blake Ian · 8:30 PM

best options become sensible and affordable options

Blake Ian · 8:30 PM

like you said about the mic closet before.... sufficed to say I do not have a U87 at home

Blake Ian · 8:30 PM

haha

Jon Katz · 8:31 PM

100%. i open up and mod a lot of my gear because i dont have the budget for very expensive gear.

Blake Ian · 8:31 PM

I LOVE my Audio technica 4033 to be versatile between my voice and my guitar and its a great option... but when I stand in front of the U87 in a pro studio, its a different league

Jon Katz · 8:31 PM

oh yea.

Blake Ian · 8:32 PM

http://www.neumann.com/?lang=en&id=current_microphones&cid=u87_description

Jon Katz · 8:32 PM

i love the 87. a good 67 and the c12 are my favorite mics!

Blake Ian · 8:32 PM

Sting carries one with him haha

Blake Ian · 8:32 PM

in a case

Blake Ian · 8:32 PM

which is the C12?

Jon Katz · 8:32 PM

http://www.akg.com/site/products/powerslave,id,210,pid,210,nodeid,2,_language,EN.html

Jon Katz · 8:33 PM

alanis used that mic into a compressor straight to tape on jagged little pill

Blake Ian · 8:33 PM

Nice, that's an amazing vocal sound

Blake Ian · 8:33 PM

that record

Jon Katz · 8:33 PM

i would have used a de-essor on her but the warmth and tone of my mic is truly amazing. that was such a great mic for her

Jon Katz · 8:33 PM

Blake Ian · 8:34 PM

I loke the AKG 414, that's what I used on my first record, one facing down at my guitar and one facing up at my voice, recorded the record live acoustic like that

Jon Katz · 8:34 PM

the 414 is very nice! and about 1/4 the price of the u87

Jon Katz · 8:35 PM

you will get a laugh but one of my "go to" mics right now is a heavily modded "cough" MXL

Jon Katz · 8:35 PM

Blake Ian · 8:35 PM

*love... not loke. haha though I did just find this! http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=loke so I guess that works

Jon Katz · 8:35 PM

lol

Blake Ian · 8:36 PM

Ive never used it, but only because I'm slightly too cool

Jon Katz · 8:36 PM

i swapped out almost all the components, modded the body, and changed the capsule. its like a real mic now lol

Jon Katz · 8:37 PM

but again thats a major difference between recording at home and in a pro studio

Blake Ian · 8:37 PM

Right, if it's a pro studio, there IS a U87 in the closet

Jon Katz · 8:38 PM

lol yes

Blake Ian · 8:38 PM

So I guess we have learned nothing!

Blake Ian · 8:38 PM

haha

Blake Ian · 8:38 PM

it's really just two different environments

Jon Katz · 8:39 PM

haha yes.

Jon Katz · 8:39 PM

its still fun to tawk though =)

Blake Ian · 8:40 PM

Of course convenience, comfort and options make for great creative environments... but so do restrictions, discomfort and limitations that force resourcefulness

Jon Katz · 8:40 PM

agreed

Blake Ian · 8:40 PM

Necessity is the mother invention...

Jon Katz · 8:40 PM

like i said before, i fond myself over critical at home. almost trying to prove something

Jon Katz · 8:40 PM

find*

Blake Ian · 8:41 PM

the only reason we have most technology in recording and other wise is because someone at home got frustrated about what they weren't able to do!

Blake Ian · 8:41 PM

don't fond yourself at home dude...

Jon Katz · 8:41 PM

yes lol..

Jon Katz · 8:42 PM

i would say the home studio pushed the creation of hardware modeled plug-ins

Jon Katz · 8:42 PM

and hybrids like the UAD

Blake Ian · 8:43 PM

Yeah it's not like pro studios don't want to save money and get more convenient too. Especially in this state of the industry

Blake Ian · 8:43 PM

haha

Jon Katz · 8:44 PM

its funny i put an SSL modeled channel strip on a lot of my busses without even thinking at home

Jon Katz · 8:44 PM

i haven't been in a pro studio in a few years. are people still tracking to tape and transferring to digital at all?

Blake Ian · 8:45 PM

hahah

Jon Katz · 8:45 PM

my things have changed =)

Blake Ian · 8:45 PM

I mean I don't really know. My experiences in pro studios in the past 5 years at least have been all to the box

Blake Ian · 8:46 PM

your things have changed?? probably because you keep fonding yourself at home!

Jon Katz · 8:46 PM

hahaha

Blake Ian · 8:47 PM

Of course there are the loyalists

Blake Ian · 8:47 PM

which I never used to get, until I made a 45 last year...

Blake Ian · 8:47 PM

and listened to the test pressing of the track on vinyl

Blake Ian · 8:48 PM

and was like wow, what have we done to music haha

Blake Ian · 8:48 PM

I mean the Mp3 has got to go pretty soon right?

Blake Ian · 8:48 PM

once the bandwidth can totally support full resolution files, why would we keep listening to overly compressed tiny pixelated versions of work that took so long to make

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

i honestly hope it goes the way video did. we had film that looked great.

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

then we had tape or vhs because it was portable

Blake Ian · 8:49 PM

right and cheap

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

and convenient

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

now we have HD

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

(and soon 4x the res of HD)

Jon Katz · 8:49 PM

i hope someone comes out with HD audio

Jon Katz · 8:50 PM

because MP3 is nothing more than musical VHS =)

Jon Katz · 8:50 PM

im a bit out there but i put a 24bit DAC in my car! i just hate MP3

Jon Katz · 8:51 PM

i think as the storage gets cheaper and ISP's get faster we may just see that.. i hope.

Blake Ian · 8:51 PM

Well both of those things are happening

Blake Ian · 8:51 PM

so yeah

Blake Ian · 8:52 PM

read something in futurist magazine that said by 2020 every person will be able to carry on a keychain. ALL of their data... ALL of their data for a lifetime

Blake Ian · 8:53 PM

so yeah it's time to use the technology to create amazing digital formats, not convenient digital formats. I agree.

Jon Katz · 8:53 PM

when i was in school they said "Digital Versatile Disk's" will one day be able to have 10 layers and hold more data then we needed.... laff =)

Blake Ian · 8:53 PM

★ Spotlighted from Adam Densky

“i would think being at home you are more relaxed”

Jon Katz · 8:53 PM

hey Adam!

Blake Ian · 8:53 PM

True Adam

Blake Ian · 8:53 PM

there are somewhat more relaxing things about it... like I was saying it's where you wrote the song, it's where you sleep etc...

Blake Ian · 8:54 PM

but keep in mind it's very relaxing to have someone else working as the engineer and you get to sit on a couch and warm up for your takes and think of creative ideas, while someone else moves the knobs and buttons

Jon Katz · 8:54 PM

in a different room too!

Blake Ian · 8:59 PM

Digital Versatile Disks is a long name... they should come up with a short name for those

Jon Katz · 8:59 PM

lol dvd?

Blake Ian · 8:59 PM

like "D Versatile Ds"

Blake Ian · 8:59 PM

nah I like D Versatile Ds

Jon Katz · 8:59 PM

i dont knw when but they chaned the name sometime around 1996

Blake Ian · 8:59 PM

;)

Jon Katz · 8:59 PM

haha

Blake Ian · 9:00 PM

Let's be real though... we are leaving out one of the best parts of Pro Studio recording

Blake Ian · 9:00 PM

inviting people, particularly female people to the studio! hahah

Blake Ian · 9:01 PM

"yooo Im at the studio... come through!"

Jon Katz · 9:02 PM

hahaha

Jon Katz · 9:02 PM

most def.

Jon Katz · 9:02 PM

Blake Ian · 9:02 PM

Ego can be pretty key to the recording process in all seriousness

Jon Katz · 9:03 PM

i cant tell you how tracks i have hearing someone run up the stairs or the stupid cat "meow"

Blake Ian · 9:03 PM

being treated well by the engineer makes a difference ... studio etiquette

Jon Katz · 9:03 PM

oh yea

Jon Katz · 9:03 PM

big time

Jon Katz · 9:07 PM

another big difference is a live recording vs all over dubs

Jon Katz · 9:08 PM

me a my friend sean typically record a guitar scratch track to a click, then record the drums then lay the real guitars, bass and vocals over

Jon Katz · 9:09 PM

very different then when i was in a pro studio

Blake Ian · 9:14 PM

totally... live recording is extremely difficult if not impossible in most home setups... recording drums alone is tough

Jon Katz · 9:18 PM

yep. thats why i got the v-drums

Blake Ian · 9:20 PM

Never used V-drums on a record actually. but I imagine they have gotten pretty usable! haha

Jon Katz · 9:21 PM

i use the MIDI output into my DAW then use Steven Slate Drums as a soft synth. its the best i can do with what i have. sounds pretty decent though

Jon Katz · 9:21 PM

can you upload files here?

Blake Ian · 9:28 PM

Nah, but you can link if its on soundcloud or anything.

Jon Katz · 9:57 PM

when i get home ill upload some tracks. not a bad sound for a home studio =)

Jon Katz · 2:15 AM

forgot to upload those tracks..

Jon Katz · 2:16 AM

this is his site.. check out some of the samples.

Jon Katz · 2:16 AM

http://www.stevenslatedrums.com/

Blake Ian · 11:00 PM

Nice... There is actually one track of mine that has completely virtual drums.... even I have a hard time believing it, and I was THERE! haha.

Blake Ian · 11:01 PM

Though I have to say, it also has a lot to do with the guy who "played" the drums... John Alicastro. He actually didn't even sit down to a rubber kit... All keyboard and mouse. Pretty crazy

Jon Katz · 11:53 PM

its beena while with this one but i uploaded a track we recorded last week check out the drums the track needs some cleanup but not to bad so far

Jon Katz · 11:53 PM

https://soundcloud.com/jon-katz-1/outside

Jon Katz · 11:54 PM

fun cover =)