Rachel McDonnell

Host

Psychology101: Common Misconceptions

Feb 12, 2014·46 visitors

Jordan Birnbaum

Cohost

Stage· 351 messages

Feb 12, 2014

Join Jordan and I Tuesday night on Tawkers to discuss the common myths and misconceptions people have concerning Psychology. We will also talk about all the different disciplines within the Psychology field and give everyone an idea just what a diverse and scientific field Psychology can be! Hope to see you there! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

Hi is Rachel home?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

Hi is Rachel home?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“Hello Tawkers.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:00 AM

Hey! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

RR!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:00 AM

Hey Jordan, hello audience! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“hello”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Hello everyone!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Taylor Thorington

“howdy”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:00 AM

it's on - how's everybody?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:00 AM

looks like we have a good crowd tonight! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:01 AM

I guess we're not the only ones interested in mental wellness

Rachel McDonnell · 2:01 AM

this is strange being in the left box tawking with you Jordan :)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:01 AM

everyone ready to tawk Psychology?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:01 AM

I know - it means I get to sit shotgun and play with the radio!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:02 AM

OK - so what do you guys think is the first thing people think of when they hear the word psychology?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“I long for wellness . . . .or at least, non-psychotic behavior.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:02 AM

get in line

Rachel McDonnell · 2:02 AM

freud or therapy

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Therapy- Counseling”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“psychopaths”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:02 AM

I thought counseling, but the psychopath thing is interesting...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:02 AM

ooh that's an interesting take Robin! We will talk about criminology a bit

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:03 AM

lol each -get out muh head

Rachel McDonnell · 2:03 AM

Yes I interviewed some of my fellow Psychology majors, grad students, and professors and their number 1 answer was that "Psychology" has become synonymous with counseling

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:03 AM

so what do you think is the stigma of counseling these days? Is there a negative stigma?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:04 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“i think mental illness still makes people pretty nervous”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:04 AM

especially w/o gun laws...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:04 AM

I don't know I think people like to "poke fun" at the idea of talking out your problems and getting to the root of things. But I think it is more acceptable now than say 20 years ago

Rachel McDonnell · 2:04 AM

in fact some take it to the extremes...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:05 AM

so I think it goes both ways

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:05 AM

Oe of the things that makes me chuckle

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:05 AM

when I hear someone disparage counselling

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:05 AM

is the "I don

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:05 AM

is the "I don't need someone to tell me what to feel," line of thinking

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:05 AM

as if that's what happens

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“My three stages of therapeutic treatment: counseling, drugs, lobotomy.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

that's more realistic

Rachel McDonnell · 2:06 AM

with mental illness it's funny to me because people automatically think of themselves as "normal" and those with illness and somehow extremely different that isn't usually the case, there could be chemical imbalances in the brain, something

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“exactly what tv does... tell us what to feel.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:06 AM

environmental that was damaging but those people aren't SO FAR apart from us

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

good point, Wayne!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“or... i don't need counseling, i'm not crazy.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:06 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“A good therapist leads you to the realizations”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:07 AM

exactly Julie - if a therapist tells you what to think or feel, find a new therapist!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:07 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“As a former practicing therapist: I like counseling - but a lobotomy is a sure thing.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:07 AM

yeah I think we has a society could benefit from shifting to a more empathetic, caring, and if nothing else.. UNDERSTANDING way of life

Rachel McDonnell · 2:07 AM

and that'sbasically what all sub disciplines of psychology aim at: to understand human behavior

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:08 AM

so before we start to expound a little more on the full science of psychology (which is fascinating)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:08 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“lobotomy sounds a little too invasive...go with the path of least resistance Rick”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:08 AM

let's first talk about why some people seem to have such an aversion to the idea of talking through things

Rachel McDonnell · 2:08 AM

I'm with you on that one Seth lol. We are not "mad scientists" either lol. lobotomy seems extreme lol

Rachel McDonnell · 2:09 AM

I will tell you if my entire undergrad career in psychology has taught me anything it is that humans strive to make their conditions and their lives comfortable

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:09 AM

Forget the century of scientific evidence demonstrating its worth - why is the prospect of just talking with someone so seemingly abhorrent?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:09 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“perhaps they are afraid they will be perceived as 'weak' or 'crazy'”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:09 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“I think people are afraid to talk about things because they are scared of the truth (i.e. the realizations)”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:10 AM

to find balance, homeostasis in a way.. and talking through difficulties is in direct opposition of that it makes people uncomfortable. it leads to outcomes they have not yet experienced

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:10 AM

so is it human nature to want to keep a fear repressed rather than face it?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:10 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Does medical marijuana count as therapy?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:10 AM

if so, I'm healed!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:10 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Rachel - so therapy makes the "uncomfortable" therefore they avoid it?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:10 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“our culture teaches us to be right. If we are proven wrong, we are embarassed”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:11 AM

yes on both counts

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:11 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“Psychology is a science - but therapy is an art.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:11 AM

great line

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:11 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“Being able to accept being 'wrong' is a sign of mental health.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:11 AM

That is a very good point Wayne! I think society and its reactions to counseling for surely affects how we view the experience too! society is a powerful thing and something we are all trying to either "conform" to or break out of

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:11 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I think the fear of being perceived as "weak" is huge, Robin. Fear that you might find out that YOU are out of your own control.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:12 AM

I think people want to repress things but logically that's not how it works. the longer your repress the more conflict you actually create...

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:12 AM

yes - getting comfortable with uncertainty is the toughest challenge life has to offer

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:12 AM

we're so self-defeating. I feel so bad for us!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:13 AM

Also our society often tends to say emotions and feelings are "weak," and that is a dangerous thing to tell us humans who are so capable of so many different emotions!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:13 AM

I think that with wisdom you realize that a demonstration of weakness is often evidence of tremendous strength

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:13 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Although it is still shunned...it is definitely more accepted than in the past. Just look at Tony Soprano and his therapist...do you think you would've ever seen a mobster going to a therapist in the past”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:13 AM

good point

Rachel McDonnell · 2:14 AM

well there is an upside Jordan, we as humans are pretty darn resilient! I think there is hope in that and hope in self-enlightenment, and encouraging others to live in a more "open" way

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“I have accepted being weak. In fact, I'm a founding member of the Society of Overeducated Underachievers.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

lol

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“is greed an emotion? because that is encouraged these days”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

good question -I don't know. Rach?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I remember when I started therapy on my 19th birthday, I said something to my mom about it (trying to get her to go with me) and she flipped her shit - so I stopped going. She didn't want me to go where anyone could make her face herself.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:14 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“my mother's fear about me going to therapy was, "I don't want you to hate me".”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:14 AM

I guess I should say here and now I am NOT on the therapy track in Psychology. I am in a more concrete, observable field

Rachel McDonnell · 2:15 AM

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:15 AM

I bet that's a pretty universal experience. I think parents subconsciously train us not to blame them as we're growing up...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:15 AM

greed is NOT an emotion

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:15 AM

i went to free therapy once, it was over-priced

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:15 AM

lmao

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:15 AM

Lucy from Peanuts only charged a nickel...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:16 AM

there is something called a "high need for power" though and I think alot of greed arguably comes from that in certain people

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:16 AM

well - I certainly hope that we can start to see therapy as a rational response to the human condition, not as a cry for help

Rachel McDonnell · 2:17 AM

@Rebecca and @Robin I think it is sad when we as a society would put blame and shame on those trying to better themselves, and that is really how I see talk therapy or counseling a tool to help you make better decisions, learn better coping skills

Rachel McDonnell · 2:17 AM

me too Jordan!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:17 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“with that in mind, high need for power, i think perhaps only certain emotions are viewed as weak.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:17 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Jordan. Agreed. So many people beneift form therapy.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:18 AM

so on that front, my gut tells me that when people exhibit greed or lack of caring, it is a result of their own psychological imbalance

Rachel McDonnell · 2:18 AM

Honestly, I just call it learning how to be a full person, repression and trying to escape the situation will never lead people to growth or feeling any better. it's about taking charge and realizing you have more power than you think you do

Rachel McDonnell · 2:18 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Social Service programs cover mental health - most even require it. Unfortunately, the programs are under-funded and under-staffed, which isn't doing much for the reputation of therapists. :/”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

like, I don't think people who are happy and emotionally stable tend to be greedy pricks.

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

greed is human nature

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

we all want more

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

in response to a deficiency

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“totally disagree, rick”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:19 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“lol! I think they might be happy, but i agree about them being emotionally unstable”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:20 AM

true! and with greed I think alot of it is taught by our society (that would be a topic found in social psychology) and we have learned that hoarding money leads to better outcomes than just giving it away. it is a conditioned response to some extent

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:20 AM

dude -trust me -not even a little happy

Rachel McDonnell · 2:20 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“love is human nature. =]”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:20 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“So is hate.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:20 AM

I think the hard truth is that human nature is ALL of these things

Rachel McDonnell · 2:20 AM

ahh the age old question is man inherently good or evil?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

and it varies based on circumstances, both past and present

Rachel McDonnell · 2:21 AM

lol this is getting a bit into philosophy but I can't resist a good debate ;)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

lust is human nature

Rachel McDonnell · 2:21 AM

exactly Jordan!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:21 AM

life is not black and white

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

and this is a problem because...?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“human nature... i think it's our nature to conform to our environment.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

well said

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“greed leads to "sucess" as defined by our capitalist culture.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:21 AM

and neither are we. everything and everyone that we interact with since the day we are born affects us and changes us

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:21 AM

certainly our culture has a HUGE impact on human nature

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:22 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Kind of true Robin...that's why a lot of people who only seek material things will always want more and never be happy”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:22 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“a greedy prick was made so by circumstances in his life”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:22 AM

all true - the question then becomes, can we forgive him or her?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:22 AM

but that might be getting religious, so let's move on!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:22 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“that depends on OUR circumstances....”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

great!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

is killing the greedy pricks an option?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

egging their house at elast?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

depends who you ask

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“If society is insane then conforming is a form of insanity.God bless the rebels!”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:23 AM

so we were talking yesterday in one of my classes about humanistic psychology - people in this field of thinking would say, "no these aren't bad people," they have just had bad things happen to them... they can change. and that is another great goal

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:23 AM

except for the Civil War

Rachel McDonnell · 2:23 AM

of psychology change is possible and encouraged

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:24 AM

I feel that way, Rach, but worry that I am naive

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:24 AM

and I get flustered by the idea that people might just be bad

Rachel McDonnell · 2:24 AM

agreed Rick! :)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:24 AM

I think that is a good point Jordan

Rachel McDonnell · 2:24 AM

I think a lot of people feel that way..

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:24 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Some people aren't salvageable, JB.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:25 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“if we are not talking about the GOP or the ultra wealthy, i can agree people can change.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:25 AM

but the research says different

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:25 AM

the research supports hope? do tell!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:25 AM

so to some extent it is separating our feelings and attitudes (which can be very biased) from factual, observable information

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:25 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“we are so easily influenced... a man i admire believes that with full control of mainstream media, 3 months would all it would take to influence a serious cultural shift. I think this is very possible.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:26 AM

that fills me with optimism and pride in my species. but then I worry it's wishful thinking and I'm an idiot.

Rachel McDonnell · 2:26 AM

I mean I have research probably every sub field in psychology because it is so fascinating. But reading studies of how Autistic children improve dramatically through behavioral training, how pedophiles have been rehabilitated through behavioral

Rachel McDonnell · 2:26 AM

reconditioning

Rachel McDonnell · 2:27 AM

all of the amazing advancements fields like neuromapping are coming up with, we are learning more and more about the amazing capabilities the brain has

Rachel McDonnell · 2:27 AM

to not only shape but reshape people's behaviors

Rachel McDonnell · 2:27 AM

and it's pretty exciting

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:28 AM

maybe this would be a good time to break down some of the different sub-genres of psych?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:28 AM

sure :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:28 AM

so will you give us the idiot's guide to psychological science?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:28 AM

ok so there are about 60 sub-fields of psychology according to the apa

Rachel McDonnell · 2:28 AM

and counseling is just one small chunk of that pie

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:28 AM

whoa

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:28 AM

we humans must be pretty complicated...

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:29 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Rebecca You cannot force people to change. It is hard to watch them destroy themselves but sometime you need to walk away.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:29 AM

That's like every episode of Intervention

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:29 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Yep, Julie. Leave and don't look back! It's heartbreaking sometimes.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:29 AM

sigh

Rachel McDonnell · 2:29 AM

I won't list them all. but you can think of the term "psychology" as the big umbrella that brings all of these subdisciplines together

Rachel McDonnell · 2:29 AM

so psychology (overall) is defined as, "a. “The scientific study of mental processes and human behavior.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:30 AM

so it is very much a "If X, then Y"

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:30 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“force almost never works... you have to open the door... they have to walk through it.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:30 AM

this definition brings together two things "mental processes" which are unobservable usually and "behavior" which is observable

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:30 AM

(that's the difference between intrinsic and extrinsic motivation, Wayne. well done!)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:31 AM

it is the overall goal of all psychologists to try and explain both the observable and unobservable parts of human behavior

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:31 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Well, if you are studying human behaviour, I can see why there are 60 sub-fields!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:31 AM

exactly

Rachel McDonnell · 2:31 AM

haha ! I love intrinsic vs extrinsic motivation! great topic!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:31 AM

I think some people want to dismiss psych as a science precisely because mental processes are unobservable

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:32 AM

but what are we going to do? Pretend it doesn't exist because we can't see it?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:32 AM

that is one of the biggest difficulties all psychologists have

Rachel McDonnell · 2:32 AM

we have to "prove" to those "Real scientists" that what we do is actually science

Rachel McDonnell · 2:33 AM

I think alot of people would be surprised to know just how scientific a lot of these sub disciplines really are

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:33 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“mental illness is not like physical illness where you can do a blood test to find out exactly what is wrong.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:33 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“@Rachel: I wrote a thesis involving Psychophysical incentives and motivation to perform.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:33 AM

neauroscience for instance merges neurology, psychology, chemistry, mathematics all together

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:33 AM

not very underachievish, Rick

Rachel McDonnell · 2:33 AM

that sounds like a paper i'd be interested in reading Rick! :)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:34 AM

ok so I'll name a few subfields of psychology

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:34 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“@ Rachel: ANd they'd be surprised to know how unscientific a lot of science is w regard to the paradigms that they accept unchallenged.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:34 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Esp. with ADD/ ADHD...those are some nasty drugs Rebecca that sadly young kids are on, and get hooked on”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:34 AM

we'll turn to meds in a moment, Seth

Rachel McDonnell · 2:34 AM

so you have the clinical psychology, which is what we have already talked about which is therapy and counseling

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:35 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Rick always taking the easy way out...”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:35 AM

lol

Rachel McDonnell · 2:35 AM

yes Rebecca that is why it is SO important to train people on what it truly means to be objective and check your sources always!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:35 AM

next is Behaviorism which is a field that became popular around the 1970's

Rachel McDonnell · 2:35 AM

This is where you hear of Pavlov's ringing bell experiment

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:36 AM

I drool every time I hear about that experiment

Rachel McDonnell · 2:36 AM

@Seth I have strong issued with taking meds to alter people's brain chemistry.. I am completely against it which is mostly why I didn't become a psychiatrist

Rachel McDonnell · 2:36 AM

haha Jordan! it worked then ;)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:36 AM

so we can be conditioned to behave without thinking about it. it's a little Manchurian candidate, right?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:36 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“It stunts growth, leads to radical behavior change and kids can never get off those drugs”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:37 AM

but at least it's profitable

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:37 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Behaviorism is the focus in a lot of Educational research”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:37 AM

yes and it is important to note that there is and should always be a high degree of morality and ethics involved in every scientific field and for good reason!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:37 AM

makes sense with all those alarm bells

Rachel McDonnell · 2:37 AM

we have an oath as scientists to do things that better society, better people

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:37 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“LOL, Rosner. And Seth, indeed it is. If I gave my kid speed, they'd take him away. If a doctor does it, he's "helping." WTF???”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:38 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“i have been on numerous meds for bi-polar disorder. non of them really helped, but they all made me so tired i could only sleep and eat.”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:38 AM

I have heard similar stories from someone else I know who has bipolar disorder Robin, it sounds so frustrating :(

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:38 AM

it certainly seems that meds have become a quick fix to help people avoid doing the real work of facing their subconscious fears. sometimes they are necessary, but more often not

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:38 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“When we were younger a child was simply hyper...now it's a medical condition that gets extra time on tests. Things have changed...”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:39 AM

Seth my parents put me on drums instead of meds

Rachel McDonnell · 2:39 AM

yes so behaviorism basically states that we are governed by the rules we are taught; namely our behavior is governed by whether it is rewarded or punished

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:39 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“One psychiatrist told me, meds are mainly used to make the patient more manageable.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:39 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“we're taught the meds are a cure-all... and we spend a LOT of money on them. Most other methods are discredited.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:39 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“@Robin: Yeah, I don't really trust meds, either. I'm a "medicine is for emergencies" type. I found out that St. John's Wort (an herb) is a hormone/mood regulator that works just fine and I switched. I watch my diet, too. It affects my brain, for sure”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:39 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Robin. I hope you find something that works. It does sound frustrating...”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:40 AM

you've got a lot of support, here Robin!@ Myself included!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:40 AM

the whole things about these meds is that once you are put on them even if they help you cannot usually every go off of them. I don't see why things like behaviorism couldn't be tried first but again not my area of expertise I also think we can

Rachel McDonnell · 2:40 AM

retrain our brains to a certain extent without drugs

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:40 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Well, what if you are rewarded for doing the wrong thing and punished for doing the right thing?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:40 AM

That's when things like genocide happen

Rachel McDonnell · 2:41 AM

so genocide is an area looked into by social psychologists

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:41 AM

so scary how anything can become normal

Rachel McDonnell · 2:41 AM

and their aim just looks at how groups of people and society influence and to a certain extent condition us to behave certain ways

Rachel McDonnell · 2:42 AM

so in the case of Hitler many of those soldiers interviewed after the fact stated that they were just going along with orders, doing what the group was doing

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:42 AM

we're sheep

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:42 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“Except LSD Psychotherapy. That was (when accessible) the hardest work of all.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:42 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Rick I heard you 'excelled' at the research”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:42 AM

lol

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:42 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“@Seth: I have a major issue with feeding kids a Western Diet of diabetes drink and fat nuggets with climb-the-walls sauce and then deciding to throw some speed or sedative in on top to make the kid able to function.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:43 AM

great line!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:43 AM

I don't like that term, but yes we feel safer in the bigger crowd. Now I think whether we are "sheep" or not depends on the society we let grow and thrive around us

Rachel McDonnell · 2:43 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Rachel Group Think?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:43 AM

You're right. I should have said we have the CAPACITY to be sheep.

Rachel McDonnell · 2:43 AM

yes! I was trying to think of the term! thanks Julie!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:43 AM

Group think = big stink

Rachel McDonnell · 2:43 AM

and that's not to say EVERYONE is like that or we wouldn't have leaders and the like

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:44 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“Rachel, is it a matter of "letting" the society grow? do we really have any control?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:44 AM

think global act local?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:44 AM

Personality Psychology could help us delve into the questions of which types of people are more likely to thrive for power or leadership etc

Rachel McDonnell · 2:44 AM

@Robin great question!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:45 AM

I think that we have the power to interact with our environment on a bigger scale than we do now

Rachel McDonnell · 2:45 AM

I think we could help change society for the better nbow

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:45 AM

look at what we're doing right now

Rachel McDonnell · 2:45 AM

it is just a matter of finding people who want to better society for the betterment of people not to gain control, power, or profit

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“It is my opinion you can use "Group Think" for good! If there are subtle changes in the culture, people will begin to follow those changes, then more people etc..”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Julie: YES!!!!!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“It's amazing what happens when you put some high-octane gas in the tank Rebecca”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Ladybird Johnson used propaganda for good - she made littering socially unacceptable. It can totally be done!”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:46 AM

exactly! and in the past think about it what we taught to step on others to get to the top in a way... leave everyone else who is "failing" behind. I think changing stereotypes and perceptions and misconceptions of other people is a very important

Rachel McDonnell · 2:46 AM

starting point

Rachel McDonnell · 2:47 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Look at the non-GMO activity lately. More people are speaking up because of the few that spoke up before.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:47 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“our biggest obstacle is awareness. too many people don't know that we could be doing better... or believe that it can't happen....”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:47 AM

yes movements are starting all around us with things like the keystone pipeline, the nsa, and gmos... people do have equal power to react to their environment as the environment has to interact with them

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:48 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“SO true @Wayne. Knowledge and awareness”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:48 AM

yes! and that is why things like tawkers is so important and learning about the sciences

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:48 AM

@wayne and @julie - so it's our jobs to speak loudly and often!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:48 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“I think it all has to do with Tawkers but I am biased :-)”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:48 AM

I LOVE it, Julie!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:48 AM

I think any and all sciences can help people regain this sense of control in that they will know they have the power to change things and hopefully for the better!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:49 AM

AND

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:49 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Absolutely! Maybe not loudly but logically and often”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:49 AM

dispelling stereotypes and misconceptions is a huge thing we can all do

Rachel McDonnell · 2:49 AM

when you hear someone saying something that is only perpetuating the same old cycle of misinformation, stop it in its tracks

Rachel McDonnell · 2:49 AM

educate people and don't talk down to them in the process

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:50 AM

yes - like spreading the word that it is scientifically proven that we are subject to emotional forces that make us act against our own self-interests and beliefs.

Rachel McDonnell · 2:50 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Rachel. Absolutely correct. people need to feel in control”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:50 AM

allowing ourselves to get comfortable with that so we can account for it

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:50 AM

mitigate the bad and nurture the good

Rachel McDonnell · 2:50 AM

Exactly Julie and that is where certain controlling behaviors can get out of hand... but we as individuals need to feel like what we do matters, that our behavior has the potential to alter situations

Rachel McDonnell · 2:50 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“i like to play devil's advocate. showing people both sides of the story”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:51 AM

that's a good way to do it Wayne.. and do it in an "I am just in it for the shared knowledge" kind of way. to me there is little worse than condescending people who say they are trying to educate people

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:51 AM

the ability to see the same thing from many perspectives can only happen if you are healthy enough to entertain doubt

Rachel McDonnell · 2:51 AM

but people aren't fools they know when they are being talked down to and they will shut you out so fast

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:51 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“people get tunnel vision these days... we need to learn to take a step back and view more angles.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

bingo

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

so what are a few more, Rach?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

how about forensic?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:52 AM

well I can plug my field :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

OUR field...

Rachel McDonnell · 2:52 AM

I am currently a grad student getting my Masters in Industrial-Organizational Psychology

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“But what happens when someone tells me something that goes against my deeply ingrained point of view?”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:52 AM

sorry Jordan, OUR field! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:52 AM

you consider, evaluate, and dismiss

Rachel McDonnell · 2:53 AM

there is a term called cognitive dissonance Julie

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:53 AM

it's the consideration that matters

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:53 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Rachel how do you suggest turning around the field of Psychology from one being driven by ins and drug company profits to one that actually is focused on improving the patient?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:53 AM

holy moly, Seth. Just a little thing like that?

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:53 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Only if I have an open mind @ Jordan. Otherwise, I just dismiss it”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:53 AM

and it states that when people have deeply engrained beliefs and values they are more likely to discount any evidence that goes contrary to these beliefs and values

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:54 AM

I think you have an open mind, Julie!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:54 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Indeed, Wayne! EF Schumacher said something great about that, along the lines of "A modern 'educated' man is one who has an opinion on everything but lacks the wisdom to know when he doesn't know enough."”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:54 AM

it has been suggested in certain research that certain types of people are more prone to cognitive dissonance and I know educate level plays a factor

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:54 AM

I like to call that group, "The Neos."

Rachel McDonnell · 2:55 AM

haha

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

(Matrix joke)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:55 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“@Jordan. I try but I am afraid a lot of individuals are suffering fro Cognitive Dissonance!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Republicans are more prone to cognitive dissonance. Reserach proved that. :D”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

obvie!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Or, rather, that people who were prone to cognitive dissonance tended to join the Republican Party.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

correlation does not imply causation

Rachel McDonnell · 2:55 AM

and it's not that educated people are better than others I think it really boils down to whether people are comfortable with shifting and changing their beliefs and minds when logical evidence is presented

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:55 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“They suffer from a lot of conditions Rebecca lol”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:56 AM

ask Aristotle how that went

Rachel McDonnell · 2:56 AM

yes correlation does not imply causation!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:56 AM

i think they drill that into our heads as Psych undergrads lol

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:56 AM

it is one of the most important things to keep in mind!

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:56 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Why is it that the people who know nothing are always so confident but the people who know everything doubt their beliefs?”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:57 AM

because life sucks

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:57 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“Wise people realize that they do not know allt he answers and are usually willing to look at different points of view. It does not mean they change their own point of view but at least they are willing to see different sides of the story”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:57 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“I was hoping for a better answer JB...”

Rachel McDonnell · 2:57 AM

this is another reason other sciences have a hard time accepting psychological results, because a lot of times we have to rely on correlation but we have many statistical and psychometric procedures that have been developed which gives us something

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:57 AM

that's what you get by the end of the Tawk, Seth

Rachel McDonnell · 2:57 AM

close to what actual experiments would give us.. if done right

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:58 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“But it was concise.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:58 AM

thnx rick

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:58 AM

so Rach, what did we cover, like 15%?

Rachel McDonnell · 2:58 AM

yeah not much

Rachel McDonnell · 2:58 AM

lol

Rachel McDonnell · 2:58 AM

there is so much more! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:58 AM

2/60 = very little

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:58 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“2 sub-fields...”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:59 AM

so I guess we have a lot more to Tawk about

Rachel McDonnell · 2:59 AM

psychology of sleeping and dreaming, criminology, abnormal psych etc... so many miles to go before we rest on this one! :)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:59 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“so, do it again sometime, Rachel and Jordan! it has been very interesting!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:59 AM

the good news is that I'm intrinsically motivated to do so!

Rachel McDonnell · 2:59 AM

thanks Robin! :)

Rachel McDonnell · 2:59 AM

I'm always down to tawk with Jordan and you all :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 2:59 AM

I had a wonderful time tonight!

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:00 AM

The forum was GREAT!!!!!!

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Now if you'll excuse me I have a couple of bottles of Corona I have to cozy up to or as I call it therapy--my HMO doesn't pay for much :-(”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:00 AM

lol

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:00 AM

And Rach, my spiritual little 'sis, you are THE BEST!

Rachel McDonnell · 3:00 AM

aww thanks! Thanks for having me everyone! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“That's what you think, J.”

Rachel McDonnell · 3:00 AM

hope you all learned a little more about Psychology than you walked in here with :)

Rachel McDonnell · 3:00 AM

And thank you Jordan! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

so fun! see you all soon!

Rachel McDonnell · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Thanks, guys! SUper fun Tawk!”

Rachel McDonnell · 3:01 AM

Night! :)

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“see ya! have a great night.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rick Rosner

“Thanks, R&J”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Wayne Delorme

“good tawk!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Julie Myers

“I can't wait to hear more! Good Tawk!”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

it's like the high-five line at the end of a game

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Seth Hochman

“Thanks guys...Corona is calling”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“the pleasant "gauntlet"”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

lol

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“OMG, JB, you're right! Good game, guys. Good Game. Good Game. Good game.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

Good game, Becca!

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“Salivating for knowledge.”

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:02 AM

Good game, Robin!

Jordan Birnbaum · 3:03 AM

★ Spotlighted from Robin Maynard

“aw thanks!”

Forum · 187

Forum· 187 comments

46 visitors

Tawkers AdminFeb 9, 2014, 11:53 PM

Welcome to the comment section of the Tawk, where audience members can share their thoughts about the main conversation happening on the left. Don't by shy! Entering questions and comments is the only way to get the attention of the two Hosts on stage!

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 1:58 AM★ Spotlighted

Hello Tawkers.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:00 AM★ Spotlighted

hello

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:00 AM★ Spotlighted

Hello everyone!

Taylor ThoringtonFeb 12, 2014, 2:00 AM★ Spotlighted

howdy

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:00 AM

Jordanski!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:01 AM★ Spotlighted

Salivating for knowledge.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:01 AM★ Spotlighted

I long for wellness . . . .or at least, non-psychotic behavior.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:02 AM★ Spotlighted

Therapy- Counseling

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:02 AM★ Spotlighted

psychopaths

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:03 AM★ Spotlighted

i think mental illness still makes people pretty nervous

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:04 AM

for sure, and rightly so, Jordan

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:05 AM★ Spotlighted

My three stages of therapeutic treatment: counseling, drugs, lobotomy.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:06 AM★ Spotlighted

exactly what tv does... tell us what to feel.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:06 AM★ Spotlighted

As a former practicing therapist: I like counseling - but a lobotomy is a sure thing.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:06 AM★ Spotlighted

or... i don't need counseling, i'm not crazy.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:06 AM★ Spotlighted

A good therapist leads you to the realizations

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:07 AM

SO true @ Jordan!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:07 AM★ Spotlighted

lobotomy sounds a little too invasive...go with the path of least resistance Rick

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:08 AM

Allright - how about pithing instead?

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:08 AM

What are the sub-disciplines?

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:08 AM★ Spotlighted

Psychology is a science - but therapy is an art.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:09 AM★ Spotlighted

I think people are afraid to talk about things because they are scared of the truth (i.e. the realizations)

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:09 AM★ Spotlighted

Does medical marijuana count as therapy?

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:09 AM★ Spotlighted

perhaps they are afraid they will be perceived as 'weak' or 'crazy'

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:10 AM★ Spotlighted

@Rachel - so therapy makes the "uncomfortable" therefore they avoid it?

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:10 AM★ Spotlighted

our culture teaches us to be right. If we are proven wrong, we are embarassed

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:11 AM★ Spotlighted

Being able to accept being 'wrong' is a sign of mental health.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:11 AM★ Spotlighted

I think the fear of being perceived as "weak" is huge, Robin. Fear that you might find out that YOU are out of your own control.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:12 AM

absolutely, Rebecca

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:13 AM

completely agree, Rachel

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:13 AM★ Spotlighted

Although it is still shunned...it is definitely more accepted than in the past. Just look at Tony Soprano and his therapist...do you think you would've ever seen a mobster going to a therapist in the past

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:14 AM★ Spotlighted

I remember when I started therapy on my 19th birthday, I said something to my mom about it (trying to get her to go with me) and she flipped her shit - so I stopped going. She didn't want me to go where anyone could make her face herself.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:14 AM★ Spotlighted

is greed an emotion? because that is encouraged these days

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:14 AM★ Spotlighted

I have accepted being weak. In fact, I'm a founding member of the Society of Overeducated Underachievers.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:14 AM★ Spotlighted

my mother's fear about me going to therapy was, "I don't want you to hate me".

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:15 AM

@ Seth - in some ways, that makes having a shrink seem like something that people with money can afford and the rest of us can't.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:15 AM

@Robin - Parents feel that way. They know they might get blamed for things that they did not do right

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:16 AM

Dr. Frazier Crane another media example...

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:16 AM

@Rachel "high need for power" = GREED

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:16 AM

or outright sociopathy maybe Rachel

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:16 AM★ Spotlighted

with that in mind, high need for power, i think perhaps only certain emotions are viewed as weak.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:16 AM

True Rebecca however I would imagine most people who see therapists long-term are wealthy since insurance covers very little mental health

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:17 AM★ Spotlighted

@Jordan. Agreed. So many people beneift form therapy.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:17 AM

excellent, Rachel

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:18 AM★ Spotlighted

Social Service programs cover mental health - most even require it. Unfortunately, the programs are under-funded and under-staffed, which isn't doing much for the reputation of therapists. :/

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:18 AM

My sister, a psychologist, says the three most hated letters in the field are HMO

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:19 AM★ Spotlighted

totally disagree, rick

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:19 AM★ Spotlighted

lol! I think they might be happy, but i agree about them being emotionally unstable

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:19 AM

I tried to escape for years!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:19 AM★ Spotlighted

love is human nature. =]

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:20 AM★ Spotlighted

So is hate.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:20 AM★ Spotlighted

greed leads to "sucess" as defined by our capitalist culture.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:21 AM★ Spotlighted

human nature... i think it's our nature to conform to our environment.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:21 AM★ Spotlighted

a greedy prick was made so by circumstances in his life

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:22 AM★ Spotlighted

Kind of true Robin...that's why a lot of people who only seek material things will always want more and never be happy

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:22 AM

for sure, Seth

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:22 AM★ Spotlighted

that depends on OUR circumstances....

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:22 AM★ Spotlighted

If society is insane then conforming is a form of insanity.God bless the rebels!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:23 AM

All major religions speak about the dangers of greed and materialism, esp. Christianity

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:23 AM

Material things cannot fill the void. Being comfortable in your own skin is a better way to go.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:23 AM

i'll buy the eggs... muahah!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:24 AM★ Spotlighted

if we are not talking about the GOP or the ultra wealthy, i can agree people can change.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:24 AM★ Spotlighted

Some people aren't salvageable, JB.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM★ Spotlighted

we are so easily influenced... a man i admire believes that with full control of mainstream media, 3 months would all it would take to influence a serious cultural shift. I think this is very possible.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM

Kind of Julie. You've to have a driving force whether that be spiritual, motivational, or simply living to help others. There must be a purpose to your existence otherwise you're living an empty life

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM

oh course, they would never hand over the controls...

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM

lol Robin

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM

@Rebecca. I think people are salvageable up to a point but once they move beyond that point they cannot be helped.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:25 AM

but wayne, no one else can GET control of the media

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:26 AM

@Rachel: HE Therapy is weak as a technique. It requires a strong background in other styles to meld in, to be effective.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:26 AM

@Julie: people can be helped only if they want to be helped and are going to be active in the process.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:26 AM

@ Julie - that's what I'm saying! If they won't accept help, if they don't want to do the work it takes to change...what are you going to do? Waterboard them into it?

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:27 AM

A great background is in Gestalt Therapy.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:27 AM

EXACTLY, Seth!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:27 AM

Yes, Rebecca. Waterboarding is so overrated lol

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:28 AM★ Spotlighted

@Rebecca You cannot force people to change. It is hard to watch them destroy themselves but sometime you need to walk away.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:29 AM★ Spotlighted

Yep, Julie. Leave and don't look back! It's heartbreaking sometimes.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:30 AM

Another great style was nude encounter groups at Esalen. You leave your disguises behind. (no pun intended)

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:30 AM★ Spotlighted

force almost never works... you have to open the door... they have to walk through it.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:30 AM

Due to insurance cost-cutting a lot of "therapy" has turned to drugs, which never solve the original problem--just put a Band-Aid on it

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:30 AM

Certainly, Wayne. That is certainly true. :)

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:31 AM★ Spotlighted

Well, if you are studying human behaviour, I can see why there are 60 sub-fields!

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:31 AM

Ah, Seth, that's a major pet peeve of mine! You're involved in ed, too, so you can understand what a problem that is in regard to children!

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:32 AM

However, I am glad I went on happy pills when I did - it tipped the scales back the other way. They weren't sufficient - I still needed counseling and self work, but I wasn't a puddle in the floor anymore!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:32 AM

No doubt...just tell Johnny to take this and he'll feel all better...

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:32 AM

But the results of those mental processes are observable @Jordan

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:33 AM

our current technology does not allow us to observe it to the majority's satisfaction....

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:33 AM★ Spotlighted

Esp. with ADD/ ADHD...those are some nasty drugs Rebecca that sadly young kids are on, and get hooked on

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:33 AM★ Spotlighted

@Rachel: I wrote a thesis involving Psychophysical incentives and motivation to perform.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:33 AM★ Spotlighted

mental illness is not like physical illness where you can do a blood test to find out exactly what is wrong.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:33 AM

it's all about perception my friends

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:34 AM

Thanks, J - but what good does that do me now?

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:34 AM★ Spotlighted

@ Rachel: ANd they'd be surprised to know how unscientific a lot of science is w regard to the paradigms that they accept unchallenged.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:34 AM

@Rachel: its a couple of hundred pages.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:34 AM★ Spotlighted

Rick always taking the easy way out...

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:35 AM

Exactly, Seth. My husband was put on kid speed back in the 90s for ADD. Hearing his experience, I would NEVER do that to anyone.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:36 AM

@Rebecca: does he have any left over?

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:36 AM★ Spotlighted

It stunts growth, leads to radical behavior change and kids can never get off those drugs

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:36 AM

It's legal Speed is what it is

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:36 AM★ Spotlighted

Behaviorism is the focus in a lot of Educational research

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:37 AM

Everything has its place, Seth.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:37 AM★ Spotlighted

LOL, Rosner. And Seth, indeed it is. If I gave my kid speed, they'd take him away. If a doctor does it, he's "helping." WTF???

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:37 AM★ Spotlighted

i have been on numerous meds for bi-polar disorder. non of them really helped, but they all made me so tired i could only sleep and eat.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:38 AM★ Spotlighted

When we were younger a child was simply hyper...now it's a medical condition that gets extra time on tests. Things have changed...

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM

Michael Phelps had really bad ADHD and that is why his mother started him on swimming. After all those exhausting practices, he was able to pay attention in school--not to mention it kind of helped in the Olympics

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM★ Spotlighted

One psychiatrist told me, meds are mainly used to make the patient more manageable.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM★ Spotlighted

@Robin: Yeah, I don't really trust meds, either. I'm a "medicine is for emergencies" type. I found out that St. John's Wort (an herb) is a hormone/mood regulator that works just fine and I switched. I watch my diet, too. It affects my brain, for sure

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM★ Spotlighted

@Robin. I hope you find something that works. It does sound frustrating...

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM★ Spotlighted

we're taught the meds are a cure-all... and we spend a LOT of money on them. Most other methods are discredited.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:39 AM

If the cause of a condition is chemical drugs may help. Or it might just be and easy way out by a lazy therapist.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:40 AM

See and that worked out just fine JB. Now you're an exec at Tawkers

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:40 AM

Julie, i have a 'carefully constructed' (by me) life and environment. that is what helps.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:40 AM★ Spotlighted

Well, what if you are rewarded for doing the wrong thing and punished for doing the right thing?

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:40 AM★ Spotlighted

Except LSD Psychotherapy. That was (when accessible) the hardest work of all.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:41 AM★ Spotlighted

@Seth: I have a major issue with feeding kids a Western Diet of diabetes drink and fat nuggets with climb-the-walls sauce and then deciding to throw some speed or sedative in on top to make the kid able to function.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:41 AM

@Robin: Good for you! No sarcasm. That's amazing!

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:42 AM

LOL@ Rebecca! Yes, the diet of the child should be the first thing that is scrutinized

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:42 AM★ Spotlighted

Rick I heard you 'excelled' at the research

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:42 AM★ Spotlighted

@Rachel Group Think?

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:43 AM

I'm a pro, Seth.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:43 AM

Incidentally, Robin, I have found with the "special needs" kids that I've worked with, a carefully constructed environment including a "clean" diet and sufficient exercise allows them to be successful. ADD/ADHD and Autism, especially!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:43 AM

Julie you're still freaking me out with that one

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:43 AM★ Spotlighted

Rachel, is it a matter of "letting" the society grow? do we really have any control?

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:44 AM

these days, "leaders" are a good part of our problems. = D

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:44 AM

Very true Rebecca...I've had a few moms put their supposed ADD children on organic diets with a lot of supplements and suddenly the condition 'disappeared'

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:45 AM

I could make a good case for calling the need for power a personality aberration.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:45 AM★ Spotlighted

It is my opinion you can use "Group Think" for good! If there are subtle changes in the culture, people will begin to follow those changes, then more people etc..

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:45 AM

@Seth: Eczema, allergies, behavioral problems, sleep problems...these fade very quickly when the kids eat good food.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:45 AM

i hope so Rachel.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:45 AM★ Spotlighted

Julie: YES!!!!!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:46 AM★ Spotlighted

It's amazing what happens when you put some high-octane gas in the tank Rebecca

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:46 AM

exactly Rachel. greed take over too often

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:46 AM★ Spotlighted

Ladybird Johnson used propaganda for good - she made littering socially unacceptable. It can totally be done!

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:46 AM★ Spotlighted

Look at the non-GMO activity lately. More people are speaking up because of the few that spoke up before.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:47 AM

Groups are generally the problem, not the solution.

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:47 AM★ Spotlighted

our biggest obstacle is awareness. too many people don't know that we could be doing better... or believe that it can't happen....

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:47 AM★ Spotlighted

SO true @Wayne. Knowledge and awareness

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:47 AM

Sadly they've not passed a GMO labeling law yet Julie

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:48 AM★ Spotlighted

I think it all has to do with Tawkers but I am biased :-)

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:48 AM

Also true, Wayne - but that's also a social construction. Essentially, people need to be "reprogrammed" out of apathy.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:48 AM★ Spotlighted

Absolutely! Maybe not loudly but logically and often

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:49 AM

Hahaha! Julie, that's a great t-shirt slogan. So nerdy and awesome!

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:49 AM★ Spotlighted

@Rachel. Absolutely correct. people need to feel in control

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM

Whatever would we do without misconceptions and rationalization?

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM

@Rebecca Nerd to the core...

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM

@Rosner: Probably stop Climate Change...

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM★ Spotlighted

i like to play devil's advocate. showing people both sides of the story

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM

Religion has always fascinated me, where you take normally logical people who do the craziest things on 'faith"

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:50 AM

I dream also, Rebecca . . . .

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:51 AM★ Spotlighted

people get tunnel vision these days... we need to learn to take a step back and view more angles.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:52 AM★ Spotlighted

But what happens when someone tells me something that goes against my deeply ingrained point of view?

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:52 AM★ Spotlighted

Rachel how do you suggest turning around the field of Psychology from one being driven by ins and drug company profits to one that actually is focused on improving the patient?

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:53 AM★ Spotlighted

Only if I have an open mind @ Jordan. Otherwise, I just dismiss it

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:53 AM

Now that's a good field, Rachel, employment-wise.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:53 AM

Julie, it is always good to re-examine your own beliefs too. and modify them, if it makes sense. =]

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:53 AM★ Spotlighted

Indeed, Wayne! EF Schumacher said something great about that, along the lines of "A modern 'educated' man is one who has an opinion on everything but lacks the wisdom to know when he doesn't know enough."

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:54 AM

lol JB. Just trying to start the dialogue...

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:55 AM★ Spotlighted

@Jordan. I try but I am afraid a lot of individuals are suffering fro Cognitive Dissonance!

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:55 AM★ Spotlighted

Republicans are more prone to cognitive dissonance. Reserach proved that. :D

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:55 AM

"from"

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:55 AM★ Spotlighted

Or, rather, that people who were prone to cognitive dissonance tended to join the Republican Party.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:55 AM★ Spotlighted

They suffer from a lot of conditions Rebecca lol

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 2:56 AM

LOL, Seth!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:56 AM★ Spotlighted

Why is it that the people who know nothing are always so confident but the people who know everything doubt their beliefs?

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:57 AM★ Spotlighted

Wise people realize that they do not know allt he answers and are usually willing to look at different points of view. It does not mean they change their own point of view but at least they are willing to see different sides of the story

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:57 AM★ Spotlighted

I was hoping for a better answer JB...

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 2:57 AM★ Spotlighted

But it was concise.

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:58 AM★ Spotlighted

2 sub-fields...

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:59 AM★ Spotlighted

so, do it again sometime, Rachel and Jordan! it has been very interesting!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 2:59 AM

yay!

Julie MyersFeb 12, 2014, 2:59 AM★ Spotlighted

I can't wait to hear more! Good Tawk!

Wayne DelormeFeb 12, 2014, 2:59 AM★ Spotlighted

good tawk!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 2:59 AM★ Spotlighted

Now if you'll excuse me I have a couple of bottles of Corona I have to cozy up to or as I call it therapy--my HMO doesn't pay for much :-(

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 3:00 AM★ Spotlighted

That's what you think, J.

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 3:00 AM

Re motivation

Rick RosnerFeb 12, 2014, 3:00 AM★ Spotlighted

Thanks, R&J

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 3:01 AM★ Spotlighted

Thanks, guys! SUper fun Tawk!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:01 AM★ Spotlighted

see ya! have a great night.

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 3:01 AM★ Spotlighted

Thanks guys...Corona is calling

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:02 AM

the pleasant "gauntlet"

Rebecca Westbrook TokerFeb 12, 2014, 3:02 AM★ Spotlighted

OMG, JB, you're right! Good game, guys. Good Game. Good Game. Good game.

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:03 AM★ Spotlighted

aw thanks!

Seth HochmanFeb 12, 2014, 3:03 AM

Rachel I heard you're dispensing free pills in the next Tawk...true?

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:03 AM

maybe i'm starting to get the hang of this 'tawking' thing

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:06 AM

our culture teaches us not to make waves. stay in the box!

Robin MaynardFeb 12, 2014, 3:06 AM

indeed, Rick