Katie Klabusich

Host

Say What? Abortion & Empathy

Jan 31, 2014·112 visitors

Kassi Underwood

Cohost

Stage· 171 messages

Jan 31, 2014

"After I had an abortion, nobody knew what to say to me. Not even Larry, my therapist. Poor Larry..." Kassi Underwood is telling everyone about her abortion experience in order to empower others and break down the shame stigma! Her piece "8 Things NOT To Say To Someone After Abortion" shar.es/9XbLD is the focus of this chat. So join us to ask questions, share your experiences and get some ProTips on being a friend and advocate!

Katie Klabusich · 11:53 PM

★ Spotlighted from Tawkers Admin

“Welcome to the comment section of the Tawk, where audience members can share their thoughts about the main conversation happening on the left. Don't by shy! Entering questions and comments is the only way to get the attention of the two Hosts on stage!”

Katie Klabusich · 12:00 AM

Hi, everyone! Thanks for coming to “Say What? Abortion & Empathy” with the fantastic award-winner writer, talker, and abortion activist Kassi Underwood!

Kassi Underwood · 12:00 AM

Hi, everybody! Thanks, Katie! Happy to be here with y'all.

Katie Klabusich · 12:00 AM

You’ve probably read Kassi in The New York Times and seen her on Melissa Harris-Perry.

Katie Klabusich · 12:00 AM

I got to know her when she read the piece we’re discussing today for the Clear Eyes telethon I co-produced that sent emergency funds to Texas clinics in November. It was friendship at first sight. ;)

Katie Klabusich · 12:01 AM

Real quick, if you’re new to Tawkers, Kassi and I will be chatting on the left. And if you’re signed in (it only takes two minutes to set up a profile!), you can add comments/questions on the right. Those are only seen by people who are signed in.

Kassi Underwood · 12:02 AM

Katie is a dynamo, everybody. She makes it all happen.

Katie Klabusich · 12:02 AM

<blushing> Kassi and I can spotlight comments to toss them into our conversation for everyone to see, so be sure to “thumbs-up” anything you want us to respond to! (That also makes it easier for us to see them.)

Katie Klabusich · 12:02 AM

REMINDER: My tawks are a safe space. All respectful comments and questions asked in good faith are welcome. We do get trolls occasionally; they can be muted by hitting the “ … “ under the thumbs or by clicking “mute” on their profile.

Katie Klabusich · 12:02 AM

Abortion in the abstract is so much different than the real-life experiences of people who go through the process of having one. Partly because of that, even those of us who are supportive in theory and thought can have trouble...

Katie Klabusich · 12:02 AM

...knowing how to express that support to a friend or family member. Kassi wrote a GREAT piece on what NOT to say to someone who’s had an abortion (everyone should read it if they haven’t already). Some parts are humorous, all are thoughtful.

Katie Klabusich · 12:03 AM

And so, tonight, Kassi has graciously donated an hour of her time to answer every question you’ve never been able to ask about supporting a friend during and/or after their abortion experience. Thanks so much, Kassi!

Kassi Underwood · 12:04 AM

It's my pleasure to be here! I had an abortion 10 years ago, so I’m honored to be able to share with you what I’ve learned about offering love and support.

Katie Klabusich · 12:04 AM

Tell me how you became outspoken about your abortion experience. It isn’t something most people run around talking about. ;)

Kassi Underwood · 12:04 AM

I started talking about it right afterward -- I grew up in Kentucky, where the word had pretty much been taken out of the English dictionary, and had my abortion in Vermont, where people were more outspoken. I wanted everybody to know who they could

Kassi Underwood · 12:05 AM

talk to if they were going through the same experience. In Vermont, despite everyone being outspoken on "issues," nobody was sharing their real experience. So I started talking and have barely stopped since.

Katie Klabusich · 12:05 AM

Ha! I know the feeling....

Katie Klabusich · 12:06 AM

I think when I accidentally told my story the first time (on air, so take "accident" with a grain of salt) and then ended up doing a little research so I could write about it, I was really struck by the

Katie Klabusich · 12:06 AM

stat that 1 in 3 women have had an abortion. And thinking, "but no one talks about it. Ever."

Kassi Underwood · 12:07 AM

I was, too. I kept thinking, where is everybody?

Katie Klabusich · 12:07 AM

RIGHT!

Kassi Underwood · 12:07 AM

And we're everywhere!

Katie Klabusich · 12:07 AM

I think no one talks about it because no one talks about it.

Katie Klabusich · 12:07 AM

And that leads to people not knowing how to react. I think I didn't want to put people in the position of having to know how to react.

Kassi Underwood · 12:07 AM

Right, but I find that if I share my story with someone, I end up hearing theirs -- whether it's about abortion or something else they haven't been able to say before.

Katie Klabusich · 12:08 AM

Absolutely.

Katie Klabusich · 12:09 AM

(Christine, I see you in the tawkers chat room -- jump in any time! ;) )

Katie Klabusich · 12:09 AM

Do you get different reactions now that you talk about your story publicly? (rather than just sharing one on one with people you already know)

Kassi Underwood · 12:10 AM

I tend to share my story to connect with people, without an overt political purpose, so I wind up hearing a lot of strangers' stories.

Katie Klabusich · 12:11 AM

I really liked that about your piece; it's about connecting with people, not proselytizing.

Kassi Underwood · 12:12 AM

The other day, at a work conference, somebody walked up to me and said, "Can I tell you about my abortion?" And she had the most beautiful story. It's an honor to hear them. I have been trained by Exhale Pro-Voice, which gave me a lot of tools for

Katie Klabusich · 12:12 AM

that's awesome!

Kassi Underwood · 12:12 AM

hearing all different stories. It's important for people to know that everyone experiences abortion differently, so there's no "one size fits all" for responding to someone's story.

Katie Klabusich · 12:13 AM

(Everyone should go like the Exhale FB page -- it's a great resource: https://www.facebook.com/ExhaleProVoice )

Katie Klabusich · 12:13 AM

Exactly. Just like there's no "right" reason for seeking an abortion, there's no "right" story to go along with the experience.

Kassi Underwood · 12:14 AM

People's experiences can change over time. After mine, I felt very empowered, so it would have been inappropriate for someone to look at me with sad eyes and say how hard it sounded.

Katie Klabusich · 12:14 AM

Ditto.

Katie Klabusich · 12:14 AM

Did you hear most of the “8 things not to say” personally?

Kassi Underwood · 12:14 AM

I heard them all.

Kassi Underwood · 12:15 AM

I've also said some of them, not knowing that other people hadn't had the exact same experience as me.

Katie Klabusich · 12:15 AM

Yeah.

Katie Klabusich · 12:15 AM

#4 “You weren’t ready for a baby.” This is the one that wouldn’t have made sense in a “what not to say” list before I had my own abortion. Now, though, the number of assumptions in those six words is astounding.

Kassi Underwood · 12:16 AM

Did you hear any "what not to says" after yours, Katie?

Katie Klabusich · 12:16 AM

In my personal life the people who knew were super supportive.

Kassi Underwood · 12:16 AM

That is amazing. What did they say that was helpful to hear?

Katie Klabusich · 12:17 AM

But I had the fortune of having two female bosses and having a good friend at one of my jobs who knew what was going on so he didn't hesitate to cover my shifts.

Katie Klabusich · 12:17 AM

Nothing. Weird, right? They just said things like "Ok. Do you need anything?"

Katie Klabusich · 12:18 AM

The co-worker who covered my bar tending shifts had been through a rough pregnancy/miscarriage with his girlfriend and he really got it.

Kassi Underwood · 12:18 AM

That's some beautiful solidarity. Thank goodness for the kindness of coworkers.

Katie Klabusich · 12:18 AM

For sure.

Katie Klabusich · 12:18 AM

Well...

Katie Klabusich · 12:18 AM

....there was my "best friend."

Katie Klabusich · 12:19 AM

I always forget about her because we don't talk anymore. It's why I posted it in the FB event for the chat.

Katie Klabusich · 12:19 AM

She pretended to be supportive, sent flowers, etc. But the night before she called to talk me out of it. The kinds of "support" she offered would sound familiar to clinic escorts who listen to sidewalk "counselors."

Kassi Underwood · 12:20 AM

Oh no, that's a really tough situation. Must have been hard to hear. What could she have done differently? Said differently? In an ideal world.

Katie Klabusich · 12:21 AM

Nothing. Or she could have listened. I think that's what I liked about your piece. You didn't just tell people what NOT to say, you made real suggestions for what people COULD say.

Katie Klabusich · 12:21 AM

A lot of people don't know how to be supportive in that situation.

Katie Klabusich · 12:22 AM

(Here's Kassi's piece if you don't have it handy: https://exhaleprovoice.org/blog-post/8-things-not-say-someone-after-abortion )

Kassi Underwood · 12:22 AM

Totally. Listening is such a great way to support someone after abortion. Surprisingly, it can take practice.

Katie Klabusich · 12:22 AM

Yeah, especially in our culture. We aren't the best listeners as a people. ;)

Katie Klabusich · 12:23 AM

A couple of your suggestions would work in any situation: "I'm listening; take your time" for example.

Kassi Underwood · 12:24 AM

We hear a lot of messages about how someone is expected to feel after abortion that it can be tempting to filter someone's story with what we have heard before. I find that it's helpful to listen openly. Show genuine interest in their story.

Katie Klabusich · 12:24 AM

Agreed.

Kassi Underwood · 12:25 AM

Absolutely. It can be scary to say how we really feel about our abortions in a world that circumscribes our emotions for us, so giving us time to talk it through can feel incredibly supportive.

Katie Klabusich · 12:25 AM

For sure.

Kassi Underwood · 12:25 AM

I starting feeling deeply, deeply sad three years after my abortion, but I was embarrassed to tell anyone.

Katie Klabusich · 12:26 AM

That just adds to the guilt people feel. "Am I reacting CORRECTLY to my abortion??"

Katie Klabusich · 12:26 AM

I thought about that.

Katie Klabusich · 12:26 AM

I wasn't sad. I was just relieved.

Katie Klabusich · 12:26 AM

What prompted the change in your feeling?

Katie Klabusich · 12:27 AM

(Pssst....there are some amazing abortion activists hanging out in the chat. You are welcome to chime in any time!)

Kassi Underwood · 12:28 AM

It's great that you feel relieved.

Kassi Underwood · 12:28 AM

That was my primary emotion for a long time. You asked what prompted the change in my feeling -- a lot of things! I moved down to Texas, where there was a lot of anti-abortion messaging. My ex had a baby with another woman and named his baby the same

Katie Klabusich · 12:30 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I think something is up with the comments section tonight.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:30 AM

(Rebecca -- yours is the first I've seen...)

Kassi Underwood · 12:31 AM

name I'd considered. In the time that had passed, I had gotten everything I said I would have needed to raise a baby -- a job, health insurance, stability. So I started thinking about it a lot.

Katie Klabusich · 12:31 AM

Oh. Your personal readiness had changed.

Katie Klabusich · 12:31 AM

Did you think back with regret or just have sadness about the timing of the pregnancy?

Kassi Underwood · 12:31 AM

There were a lot of different factors and that was definitely one of them.

Katie Klabusich · 12:32 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Readers should try to refresh and see if that corrects the problem.”

Kassi Underwood · 12:32 AM

My feelings changed throughout the day -- one minute, I'd regret it, the next minute, I'd wonder what I was so emotional about. Now I know it can be normal to have many different emotions, some of them at the same time. It's also normal to feel

Kassi Underwood · 12:33 AM

complete relief.

Katie Klabusich · 12:33 AM

For sure! About a number of different life experiences.

Katie Klabusich · 12:33 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“I can see comments now! :)”

Katie Klabusich · 12:33 AM

I think that's (hooray, comments are working!) what people don't consider:

Kassi Underwood · 12:33 AM

Yay, comments! Would love to hear from everybody.

Katie Klabusich · 12:33 AM

Any life experience or decision or event can have multiple emotions and occasional regret or joy or sadness.

Katie Klabusich · 12:34 AM

Rebecca awesomely figure it out -- tawkers may need to hit refresh. ;) Hooray for new platforms and technology!

Kassi Underwood · 12:34 AM

Absolutely. For me, having an abortion was unlike any other life experience or decision, and it was important for me to acknowledge that.

Katie Klabusich · 12:35 AM

Right. Anything that's new or different could elicit unexpected emotions.

Katie Klabusich · 12:35 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I don't know if it's appropriate to bring it up here, but when I was 19, an acquaintance asked me to drive her to the doctor. I didn't know until after the procedure that she had had an abortion. I always wished that had happened differently.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:35 AM

Rebecca -- do you think she was embarrassed? afraid to tell you?

Katie Klabusich · 12:35 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I would have liked to support her, and i was hur tthat she didn't tell me what was going on.”

Kassi Underwood · 12:36 AM

Rebecca, thanks for your comment! I think that's amazing that you would have liked to support her. And it's understandable that you would feel hurt.

Katie Klabusich · 12:36 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Looking back, probably. maybe she was afraid i wouldn't drive her - i think many people had already turned her down.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:36 AM

I know there are people I didn't tell because I didn't want to put them in the position of knowing that about me.

Katie Klabusich · 12:37 AM

I have deep red state family that wouldn't have (and don't) approved and I wasn't sure how extended friend groups would feel. I didn't want close friends to have to keep a secret.

Kassi Underwood · 12:37 AM

Rebecca, you are reminding me that I asked to borrow someone's car to get to my abortion and never told her why, though I'm pretty sure she had heard from others -- now I want to go and tell her the truth. I'm really glad you shared that.

Katie Klabusich · 12:37 AM

You drove by yourself?

Katie Klabusich · 12:37 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Afterward, when we were driving back and she told me what was up, i was floored, very unprepared and i wish i had been able to...you know, be ready to be supportive. As it was, i was just like, should we get ice cream?”

Kassi Underwood · 12:38 AM

Katie, you're so compassionate to want to keep your friends from having to keep a secret.

Katie Klabusich · 12:38 AM

I would have personally loved that response.

Katie Klabusich · 12:38 AM

Thanks! I had a friend come out to me after college and I had a similar reaction to Rebecca. (Actually, I smacked him in the arm b/c we're like family) "Why didn't you think y ou could tell me??"

Kassi Underwood · 12:38 AM

Rebecca, that would have been the PERFECT response for me. (Though I can't speak for everyone!) I would have loved ice cream. So what happened?

Katie Klabusich · 12:39 AM

He said he didn't want me to be burdened with his secret. I guess it stuck with me.

Katie Klabusich · 12:40 AM

I'm with Kassi -- even if she didn't want ice cream, it has an accepting/supportive feel to the offer. Especially since she probably hadn't eaten yet that day.

Kassi Underwood · 12:41 AM

I've learned from the many people I've talked to about their abortions that they keep it a secret for all different reasons, so it's normal. And ice cream rules.

Katie Klabusich · 12:41 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I think we got ice cream. And I just tried to be there for her. We were counselors at a summer camp, so she got to stay in bed for a few days, but not long. I really felt for her, because she was from England, just summering in the US...”

Katie Klabusich · 12:41 AM

Word.

Katie Klabusich · 12:41 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“and we were the only "family" she had to lean on. It was a strange environment in which to navigate that. Her immediate supervisor was a dude, and I was the one over him. I don't think we did a great job.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:42 AM

Well, something about you made her comfortable coming to you. And she clearly knew she could lean on you afterward when she was ready to tell you.

Kassi Underwood · 12:42 AM

Katie, to answer your earlier question, I drove with my ex. Afterward, he dropped me off about a three-quarter mile walk away from my dorm room in the borrowed car, bless his heart. I felt strong, walking back.

Katie Klabusich · 12:42 AM

Damn.

Katie Klabusich · 12:42 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I hope that's true. Thanks. :)”

Katie Klabusich · 12:43 AM

The thing not to say that stood out to me because I hear versions of it as a clinic escort and I have people tell me it's why they don't talk about their abortions, is this one:

Kassi Underwood · 12:43 AM

Rebecca, just reading what you're saying here, you would have been the ideal person for me to see after my abortion.

Katie Klabusich · 12:43 AM

"6. I don’t support what you did, but I’m here to support you."

Katie Klabusich · 12:44 AM

Agreed. Rebecca rocks.

Kassi Underwood · 12:44 AM

It's settled.

Katie Klabusich · 12:44 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Thanks. :)”

Katie Klabusich · 12:44 AM

There are people who really do think in their own heads that saying "I don't support what you did, but I support you," isn't completely insulting and transparent.

Kassi Underwood · 12:46 AM

I come from a conservative family in Kentucky (not my immediate family, but my extended), who have said that kind of thing, especially since I've talked about my abortion in public. It can feel condemning to hear those words.

Katie Klabusich · 12:46 AM

Uh huh. That's the shit I hear from my mother about everything.

Katie Klabusich · 12:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“It's a crap line. It's like that lame discipline line about how you love the person, not the behavior.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:46 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“It IS condemning! It's a stupid, mean thing to say!”

Katie Klabusich · 12:47 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“I have a friend who says that quite often, Katie! She wants to support people after their abortion, but says she "can't support what they did." I feel like those words hurt more than they help.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:47 AM

A person's abortion experience is part of their larger personal narrative. It isn't separate from the rest of them. It's connected to the rest of their life; you can’t be judgey about their experience w/o judging them as a person.

Katie Klabusich · 12:47 AM

You can certainly disagree internally, but keep that crap to yourself.

Kassi Underwood · 12:48 AM

As a general rule, the word "but" doesn't need to be part of a supportive conversation. Anyone looking for a great resource on supporting people after abortion can check out exhaleprovoice.org. Especially the pro-voice counseling guide.

Katie Klabusich · 12:48 AM

YES

Katie Klabusich · 12:48 AM

EXACTLY

Katie Klabusich · 12:48 AM

No buts

Katie Klabusich · 12:48 AM

Katie Klabusich · 12:48 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“You never hear these people say, "I support the troops but I don't support what they do." Why do they think that line is okay to use on small children and women whom they are treating as small children?”

Katie Klabusich · 12:49 AM

Right. It's extremely condescending.

Kassi Underwood · 12:50 AM

It's important for people to know that they do not need to change their views to support us. The best approach is to listen and ask open-ended questions.

Katie Klabusich · 12:51 AM

Exactly.

Katie Klabusich · 12:51 AM

My logical side always wonders...

Katie Klabusich · 12:51 AM

do people think that strategy is going to work? In the middle of an emotional or confessional story, THAT is when you try and preach to someone?

Katie Klabusich · 12:51 AM

Even compassion aside, it doesn't make much sense.

Kassi Underwood · 12:51 AM

They can say, "I'm glad you feel empowered" and just leave out the rest. They can say, "I hear you're feeling guilty. Can you tell me more about the reasons you feel guilty?"

Katie Klabusich · 12:52 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“What are some questions you think are the most beneficial?”

Katie Klabusich · 12:52 AM

Before I forget and while Kassi’s answering Kendra’s question -- everyone should follow Kassi on twitter @kassiunderwood -- she's super responsive and a great resource/ally. <3

Kassi Underwood · 12:53 AM

It depends on what someone brings to you, but if someone tells you they're feeling angry, you say, "Can you tell me more about what's making you angry right now?" "What else?" Give them a chance to let it all out.

Katie Klabusich · 12:54 AM

The basic "Ok, tell me more, I'm listening" kinds of responses.

Kassi Underwood · 12:54 AM

If someone says, "What should I do?" (about their feelings), you can say, ""Let's talk about your options." Or "I can't know what's best for you. We can brainstorm some ideas together if that's what you want."

Kassi Underwood · 12:54 AM

Yes -- "Tell me more" can be a wonderful thing to hear.

Kassi Underwood · 12:55 AM

"How do you feel about that?" "What do you think?"

Katie Klabusich · 12:55 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“What about, "I'm sorry"?”

Katie Klabusich · 12:55 AM

And if someone is conflicted and you don't know how to help or what to say, Your Backline is a great counseling resource: http://yourbackline.org

Kassi Underwood · 12:55 AM

Another one: "It sounds to me you're feeling guilty/ashamed/free/etc. Am I getting this right?" Check and make sure you're hearing what they're saying.

Katie Klabusich · 12:56 AM

I think I would substitute that for "I'm sorry," just in case you're hearing conflicting feelings.

Katie Klabusich · 12:56 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“I think I sometimes forget those kind of questions, and then the conversation kind of drops, and I know it's probably weird for the other person.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:56 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Like, i hate it when someone says to me, "I'm sorry you feel that way." But an empathetic "I'm sorry" can feel great.”

Katie Klabusich · 12:57 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“ooh, katie, that's a good one. Because "I'm sorry" can be touchy.”

Kassi Underwood · 12:57 AM

Rebecca, that is so true. "I'm sorry" can be tricky, because we have to make sure we're not conveying pity. But an "I'm sorry" done well can be lovely to hear.

Katie Klabusich · 12:58 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“Oh, I'm definitely guilty of the "I'm sorry!" Never realized how touchy it could be. I like those alternatives!”

Katie Klabusich · 12:58 AM

Yeah, "I'm sorry" can also be a leading phrase. It can sound like that's what you expect them to feel even tho you're just trying to convey empathy. Asking if you're hearing their feelings correctly can help you dodge that.

Katie Klabusich · 12:59 AM

Wow! We've run out of time! Thanks so much to everyone for listening and asking great questions.

Kassi Underwood · 12:59 AM

Kendra -- it's normal that you would forget those questions, because nobody teaches us how to have these conversations! That you are here today shows me you're a really supportive person.

Katie Klabusich · 1:00 AM

EXACTLY. The more we talk about our experiences, the better allies we will all be.

Katie Klabusich · 1:00 AM

Everyone go "like" Kassi's FB page: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Kassi-Underwood/122148801297210

Katie Klabusich · 1:00 AM

to keep up with her talking and teaching and writing!

Katie Klabusich · 1:00 AM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“Thank you both for doing this Tawk. And for your vocal activism. It's important!”

Katie Klabusich · 1:01 AM

★ Spotlighted from Kendra Cooper

“Thank y'all for taking the time to do this! <3”

Kassi Underwood · 1:01 AM

Thank you all for being here! If you're listening and you've had an abortion, I want you to know that I'm with you. There's no right way to feel.

Katie Klabusich · 1:01 AM

Anyone listening who didn't want to post public comments and questions can always find us on social media.

Katie Klabusich · 1:01 AM

Agreed! Thanks everyone and go have some ice cream! ;)

Kassi Underwood · 1:01 AM

Thank you, Katie, for organizing! You're an inspiration. And thank you to all who participated.

Katie Klabusich · 1:01 AM

The feeling is mutual. <3

Kassi Underwood · 1:02 AM

And when I say there's on "right" way to feel -- I mean no right OR wrong way to feel.

Forum · 24

Forum· 24 comments

112 visitors

Tawkers AdminJan 9, 2014, 4:48 AM★ Spotlighted

Welcome to the comment section of the Tawk, where audience members can share their thoughts about the main conversation happening on the left. Don't by shy! Entering questions and comments is the only way to get the attention of the two Hosts on stage!

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:30 AM★ Spotlighted

I think something is up with the comments section tonight.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:31 AM★ Spotlighted

Readers should try to refresh and see if that corrects the problem.

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 12:33 AM★ Spotlighted

I can see comments now! :)

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:35 AM★ Spotlighted

I don't know if it's appropriate to bring it up here, but when I was 19, an acquaintance asked me to drive her to the doctor. I didn't know until after the procedure that she had had an abortion. I always wished that had happened differently.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:35 AM★ Spotlighted

I would have liked to support her, and i was hur tthat she didn't tell me what was going on.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:36 AM★ Spotlighted

Looking back, probably. maybe she was afraid i wouldn't drive her - i think many people had already turned her down.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:37 AM★ Spotlighted

Afterward, when we were driving back and she told me what was up, i was floored, very unprepared and i wish i had been able to...you know, be ready to be supportive. As it was, i was just like, should we get ice cream?

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:40 AM★ Spotlighted

I think we got ice cream. And I just tried to be there for her. We were counselors at a summer camp, so she got to stay in bed for a few days, but not long. I really felt for her, because she was from England, just summering in the US...

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:41 AM★ Spotlighted

and we were the only "family" she had to lean on. It was a strange environment in which to navigate that. Her immediate supervisor was a dude, and I was the one over him. I don't think we did a great job.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:42 AM★ Spotlighted

I hope that's true. Thanks. :)

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:44 AM★ Spotlighted

Thanks. :)

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:46 AM★ Spotlighted

It's a crap line. It's like that lame discipline line about how you love the person, not the behavior.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:46 AM★ Spotlighted

It IS condemning! It's a stupid, mean thing to say!

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 12:46 AM★ Spotlighted

I have a friend who says that quite often, Katie! She wants to support people after their abortion, but says she "can't support what they did." I feel like those words hurt more than they help.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:48 AM★ Spotlighted

You never hear these people say, "I support the troops but I don't support what they do." Why do they think that line is okay to use on small children and women whom they are treating as small children?

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 12:51 AM★ Spotlighted

What are some questions you think are the most beneficial?

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:55 AM★ Spotlighted

What about, "I'm sorry"?

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 12:56 AM★ Spotlighted

I think I sometimes forget those kind of questions, and then the conversation kind of drops, and I know it's probably weird for the other person.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:56 AM★ Spotlighted

Like, i hate it when someone says to me, "I'm sorry you feel that way." But an empathetic "I'm sorry" can feel great.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 12:57 AM★ Spotlighted

ooh, katie, that's a good one. Because "I'm sorry" can be touchy.

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 12:57 AM★ Spotlighted

Oh, I'm definitely guilty of the "I'm sorry!" Never realized how touchy it could be. I like those alternatives!

Rebecca Westbrook TokerJan 31, 2014, 1:00 AM★ Spotlighted

Thank you both for doing this Tawk. And for your vocal activism. It's important!

Kendra CooperJan 31, 2014, 1:00 AM★ Spotlighted

Thank y'all for taking the time to do this! <3