Katie Klabusich

Host

So, Are Iran + US Getting Along Now?

Dec 4, 2013·56 visitors

Michael Brooks

Cohost

Stage· 213 messages

Dec 4, 2013

Iran and the US have a complicated history. That's about where most of us begin and end our understanding of the relationship between our two countries, what it means and why it's important. nThankfully, writer/analyst/radio host Michael Brooks is joining me to explain what's going on! nGet a preview from Michael's middle of the night appearance from the day the deal was announced and bring your questions: http://youtu.be/_d6WjJ7QkJg

Katie Klabusich · 9:40 PM

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Katie Klabusich · 9:40 PM

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Katie Klabusich · 11:00 PM

Hey, everyone! Thanks for coming!

Katie Klabusich · 11:00 PM

Thanks for coming back, Michael!

Katie Klabusich · 11:01 PM

★ Spotlighted from Jordan Birnbaum

“If we ARE getting along, it's probably best not to mention that whole CIA-directed coup thing….”

Michael Brooks · 11:02 PM

Hi Katie

Katie Klabusich · 11:02 PM

There he is! Hooray, technology. lol

Katie Klabusich · 11:02 PM

If you're new to Tawkers, Michael and I will see comments that get a thumbs-up from "listeners" and then we can throw them into the chat. So help each other out by highlighting anything you want us to respond to!

Michael Brooks · 11:02 PM

Am I coming through?

Katie Klabusich · 11:02 PM

Yep! Thanks for coming back for another chat.

Michael Brooks · 11:03 PM

my pleasure

Katie Klabusich · 11:03 PM

So a thing happened with Iran recently. Which is probably about where most Americans tunes out.

Michael Brooks · 11:03 PM

Katie Klabusich · 11:03 PM

In our collective defense, most of us weren't alive the last time news from Iran was positive.

Katie Klabusich · 11:03 PM

Jordan mentioned the coup (thanks, Jordan, lol)

Michael Brooks · 11:04 PM

Jordan is on it

Michael Brooks · 11:05 PM

so basically what was agreed to between Iran and the US along with other Western powers and China was six month deal that would halt certain types of enrichment in Iran's nuclear program in exchange for some sanctions being relaxed in the form of som

Michael Brooks · 11:05 PM

money flowing to Iran

Katie Klabusich · 11:05 PM

That sounds positive. Unless you're John McCain, I suppose.

Michael Brooks · 11:06 PM

right

Katie Klabusich · 11:06 PM

In your interview with France 24, you mentioned that there are potentially "long term strategic implications of the deal" because of the way the president is engaging in real diplomacy.

Michael Brooks · 11:06 PM

he isn't even the worst

Michael Brooks · 11:06 PM

for sure

Katie Klabusich · 11:06 PM

Ugh….

Katie Klabusich · 11:06 PM

Obviously, there are concrete, measurable effects on especially the Iranian people with sanctions being lifted, but can you first give a brief, broader picture for what this sort of engagement does for our standing in the world and the way other coun

Katie Klabusich · 11:06 PM

**countries interact with our leaders and diplomats?

Michael Brooks · 11:06 PM

this is what Obama campaigned on doing when he first ran for President in 2007-2008. Making these types of deals

Michael Brooks · 11:07 PM

so its important in that sense

Katie Klabusich · 11:07 PM

I remember. It's one of the reasons I campaigned for him.

Katie Klabusich · 11:07 PM

In the promise-keeping sense.

Michael Brooks · 11:07 PM

also war with Iran would be a absolute horror show in ever way and the assumption that we need war is absurd its not a correct reading of the Iranian regime

Katie Klabusich · 11:08 PM

The demonization of Iran -- the people as well as the leadership -- has always looked like a hawkish caricature.

Michael Brooks · 11:08 PM

so we both get Obama affirming some of what he has articulated abut his approach to global affairs and the lessoning of the potential of a really stupid and sure to be incredibly destructive war

Katie Klabusich · 11:09 PM

So, good for everybody! And not just our two countries. This is happening in a pretty unstable part of the world. Reducing the likelihood for war sounds like a thing everyone should be into.

Michael Brooks · 11:10 PM

Well look, in Iran's case this is a government that has a terrible human right record and certainly has been involved in things outside of its borders like backing Assad in Syria that are really not good, but this is also a rational regime one you

Michael Brooks · 11:10 PM

can do business with

Katie Klabusich · 11:11 PM

Perhaps that's why diplomacy with Iran didn't happen in Obama's first term?

Michael Brooks · 11:11 PM

its good for the world in a big picture sense but some of Iran's neighbors

Michael Brooks · 11:11 PM

I think it would be much harder to cut this deal in his first term

Michael Brooks · 11:12 PM

for sure

Katie Klabusich · 11:12 PM

You mentioned Iran's neighbors…who's not happy about this development? There's always some asshole around to ruin the party….

Michael Brooks · 11:12 PM

lol

Michael Brooks · 11:13 PM

well Israel who under their present very right wing government opposes this deal and the Saudi's and other Gulf states who are fighting proxy wars with Iran in hot spots like Syria

Katie Klabusich · 11:14 PM

So, those who may lose some power and influence.

Michael Brooks · 11:15 PM

I think with Bibi in Israel (the PM) and the Israeli right generally Iran is a big distraction from its own unmet obligations and policy problems

Michael Brooks · 11:15 PM

a former Israeli intelligence director said today that coming to a real solution with the Palestinians is far more pressing for Israel than Iran and that's true

Katie Klabusich · 11:16 PM

★ Spotlighted from Jordan Birnbaum

“What's the state of the Green Movement in Iran?”

Michael Brooks · 11:16 PM

but this Israeli government does not want to really do anything other than continue build settlments

Katie Klabusich · 11:16 PM

Perhaps that makes Iran a bit like the US -- the leaders use distractions from outside their boarders to avoid pressing issues at home.

Michael Brooks · 11:16 PM

the Saudi's and other Gulf States have religious divisions with Iran and don't want their power usured

Katie Klabusich · 11:17 PM

Israel and Iran, rather

Michael Brooks · 11:17 PM

everyone uses stuff outside of their borders to distrct

Michael Brooks · 11:17 PM

that is totally global

Katie Klabusich · 11:17 PM

My brain was jumping ahead a little -- it's the community builder in me. I think a lot about the difference between the "general" population and the leadership.

Michael Brooks · 11:17 PM

right

Katie Klabusich · 11:18 PM

We project what we hear from the vocal officials onto the population, something we should have learned not to do during the Bush presidency.

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

right and in Iran's case you see in things like the Green Movement which was crushed but the impulse towards domestic reform and globally opening is very strong in public opinion

Katie Klabusich · 11:19 PM

(good callback to Jordan's questions!)

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

To sort of answer Jordan's question as well

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

I do my best

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

lol

Katie Klabusich · 11:19 PM

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

thank you

Michael Brooks · 11:19 PM

Katie Klabusich · 11:20 PM

Break down the basic terms of the treaty -- and does it have an official-sounding name, or are we stuck with "That Treaty With Iran?"

Michael Brooks · 11:20 PM

we could call it an interim agreement

Katie Klabusich · 11:20 PM

Right, because this is just the start of the process.

Katie Klabusich · 11:21 PM

The "How About No Nuclear War?" Interim Agreement.

Michael Brooks · 11:21 PM

basically Iran has agreed to slow down and not reach certain levels of enrichment in its nuclear program and continue with international inspections and in exchange the Obama Administration is letting go of about 7 billion dollars

Michael Brooks · 11:22 PM

with of Iranian funds that were frozen

Michael Brooks · 11:22 PM

lol

Katie Klabusich · 11:22 PM

Wow, so that was money that belonged to Iran, but we had it? Or did we somehow just manage to freeze the funds the way the US does with criminals under investigation?

Michael Brooks · 11:24 PM

we have had pretty strong and coordinated sanctions against them. the funds are coming out of some things like unfrozen oil assets that we had blocked from going to Iran

Katie Klabusich · 11:24 PM

You and Reza Marashi, Research Dir at the National Iranian American Council discussed the number of places sanctions on Iran come from -- the US, the UN, etc

Michael Brooks · 11:24 PM

right

Katie Klabusich · 11:24 PM

Are most of those of the "frozen oil" variety? or are there other kinds of sanctions?

Michael Brooks · 11:25 PM

also some petrochemicals

Michael Brooks · 11:25 PM

Iran's main export is oil

Katie Klabusich · 11:25 PM

(PS everyone should get Michael's podcast "Intersection" from Aslan Media -- it's on iTunes now, hooray!)

Michael Brooks · 11:25 PM

word

Katie Klabusich · 11:25 PM

Right, I was inarticulately asking if the sanctions are mostly economic/trade.

Michael Brooks · 11:26 PM

those are the ones most felt by the general population for sure

Katie Klabusich · 11:26 PM

Gotcha.

Katie Klabusich · 11:26 PM

Are sanctions only being lifted by the six countries in the treaty, or will there be additional action by the UN and others?

Michael Brooks · 11:27 PM

nothing else so far but the other countries involved don't have the same level of sanctions some European oils companies as an example still operate in Iran

Michael Brooks · 11:28 PM

the basic point to resolve is between the US and Iran

Katie Klabusich · 11:28 PM

Ok, so the bulk, if you will, are US sanctions.

Michael Brooks · 11:28 PM

and we have led the global efforts

Michael Brooks · 11:28 PM

to enforce this regime

Katie Klabusich · 11:28 PM

The other countries were just at the table and in agreement? Perhaps to provide accountability and legitimacy?

Michael Brooks · 11:29 PM

they also have difficult relations in many cases-the relations are not entirely normal or positive but the root is between the US and Iran from where I see it

Michael Brooks · 11:29 PM

although I think concerns about the nuclear program are broadly shared

Katie Klabusich · 11:29 PM

Interesting….

Katie Klabusich · 11:29 PM

And in real world terms, how can the "average" (I hate that word, but it'll work) Iranian citizen expect their every day lives to change now with some sanctions lifted and

Katie Klabusich · 11:30 PM

as the negotiating process continues, assuming a successful finalization of the treaty six months from now? If they can expect change, that is.

Michael Brooks · 11:31 PM

The economy improving at all will really help. I think there is also a real desire for domestic reform and we will see what Rouhani ends doing with that

Katie Klabusich · 11:31 PM

So it's a general improving of the economy that will be felt by the population?

Michael Brooks · 11:32 PM

I think so

Michael Brooks · 11:32 PM

again not in a totally profound shift but it will have a real impact

Michael Brooks · 11:32 PM

hopefully

Katie Klabusich · 11:33 PM

What should we be watching for over the next six months as far as tracking the negotiations? Or will that all be done behind closed doors and in June we'll just get another announcement from POTUS?

Michael Brooks · 11:34 PM

The big thing to watch from an American perspective is all of the work that neo-cons and other like minded people will put into killing the deal

Michael Brooks · 11:34 PM

this "Iran Facts" video which I did a commentary on this past monday on the Majority Report is one thing

Katie Klabusich · 11:34 PM

(By the way, I see ya'll in the audience out there -- you can ask anything! That's why I brought a translator with me. ;] )

Michael Brooks · 11:34 PM

I bet some people have seen that youtube video

Katie Klabusich · 11:35 PM

Right. If neocons in Congress pass legislation with sanctions, it ends the deal. So that's a big deal.

Michael Brooks · 11:35 PM

so people saying we need more sanctions even after this deal or others saying that any final deal shouls mean Iran has no right to enrich at all

Michael Brooks · 11:35 PM

those are the arguments and policies that can kill a deal

Katie Klabusich · 11:36 PM

Too many "deals" in that comment. lol Right, more sanctions means an end to this good news and positive development business.

Michael Brooks · 11:36 PM

and honestly most of those people don't want a deal they want war

Katie Klabusich · 11:36 PM

That's just unfathomable to me.

Michael Brooks · 11:36 PM

more sanctions means that Congress slaps the President, the p5+1 countries and Iran in the face

Michael Brooks · 11:37 PM

well some people have made a life out of turning Iran into some video game villian

Katie Klabusich · 11:37 PM

What's with that "Iran Facts" video? Is that just a disinformation campaign attempting to discredit the treaty process?

Michael Brooks · 11:37 PM

and they will keep beating the same drum

Katie Klabusich · 11:37 PM

I think those people might be the real "Axis of Evil."

Michael Brooks · 11:38 PM

well basically it just reminds everyone of the hostage taking after the revolution in 1979 which obviously was horrible and than it just lists a bunch of pieces of anti American rhetoric from Iranian leaders

Michael Brooks · 11:38 PM

including Rouhani and in the end says call your Congressperson and ask for more sanction

Michael Brooks · 11:38 PM

that's it

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

With no mention of US activity, I suppose.

Michael Brooks · 11:39 PM

its crap but well done

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

Talk about one-sided.

Michael Brooks · 11:39 PM

of course not

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

Well done crap.

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

We're full of that in this country.

Michael Brooks · 11:39 PM

well done crap

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

We need to start a new media company "Well Done Crap."

Katie Klabusich · 11:39 PM

Ok, no.

Michael Brooks · 11:39 PM

something take pride in as an american but i don't want it leading to stupid foreign policy

Michael Brooks · 11:40 PM

yes

Michael Brooks · 11:40 PM

let's do it

Katie Klabusich · 11:40 PM

Or stupid policy period. We've got enough of it.

Michael Brooks · 11:40 PM

well done crap llc

Michael Brooks · 11:40 PM

right

Katie Klabusich · 11:40 PM

lol Next Tawk brought to you by "Well Done Crap, Inc."

Katie Klabusich · 11:40 PM

Very few people in this country know Iran outside the "Axis of Evil" persona the Bush administration painted it with.

Michael Brooks · 11:40 PM

yes

Katie Klabusich · 11:41 PM

Is that why neocons and asshole one-precent media people pound us with Iran? Do they just see it as an easy target?

Michael Brooks · 11:41 PM

people can find that commentary on youtube by looking up Michael Brooks The Shadowy Groups Still Trying to Take Us to War With Iran

Katie Klabusich · 11:42 PM

( here's the link: http://youtu.be/V5vn11l_9pY )

Michael Brooks · 11:42 PM

well i think there are a ton of reasons and some of it does have to do with that fact that Iran does pursue some awful policies and its leaders say some terrible things

Michael Brooks · 11:43 PM

but, you know these neo-con types just have a demented and really simplistic worldview that refuses to see context

Katie Klabusich · 11:43 PM

Yeah. BLACK! WHITE! EVIL!

Michael Brooks · 11:43 PM

and its amazing to see after Iraq and all the other failures just pushing for the same nonsense

Katie Klabusich · 11:43 PM

That occasionally sounds attractive

Katie Klabusich · 11:43 PM

Not the Iraq failures -- the simplicity. lol

Michael Brooks · 11:44 PM

right black or white-and what's funny is the realists can at their worst be like Kissinger just totally amoral

Michael Brooks · 11:44 PM

but you need realism to function succesfully

Katie Klabusich · 11:44 PM

We aren't all that great at "real" around here. Especially when so many people's daily lives are hard; fantasy feels better.

Michael Brooks · 11:44 PM

so ethical realism and think more like an anthropolgist than a policy geek to figure some of what's really happening in another place

Katie Klabusich · 11:44 PM

That's an interesting way to put it.

Katie Klabusich · 11:45 PM

The anthropologist is required to see all the groups as human...

Katie Klabusich · 11:45 PM

…and to take a longer-term view.

Michael Brooks · 11:45 PM

and look at culture, context and motivation across many different domains

Michael Brooks · 11:46 PM

and you can still to really figure things out

Katie Klabusich · 11:46 PM

You're forced to identify similarities as well.

Michael Brooks · 11:46 PM

Like with Iran but of the reason they will not give up the right to enrich is from a sense of pride and dignity that transcends even this government its fundamental drive for them

Michael Brooks · 11:46 PM

yes

Michael Brooks · 11:47 PM

and we need to understand the history and the context behind that

Michael Brooks · 11:47 PM

including the 1953 cou[

Michael Brooks · 11:47 PM

that Jordan mentioned before

Katie Klabusich · 11:48 PM

Yeah. There's the "c-word" again...

Katie Klabusich · 11:48 PM

…context.

Michael Brooks · 11:49 PM

right

Michael Brooks · 11:49 PM

i dig that word

Katie Klabusich · 11:49 PM

Does the Iranian population have the same attachment to the enrichment (me too) program as their leaders? Or is there a distance similar to what

Katie Klabusich · 11:49 PM

average Americans feel between ourselves and the ruling elite/elected officials?

Michael Brooks · 11:50 PM

No, I think that the notion that we should not be dictated what our energy program is by outside powers is broadly held sentiment in Iran

Michael Brooks · 11:50 PM

other things of course there are the types of elite v public split you are talking about but I don't think on thar

Michael Brooks · 11:50 PM

Michael Brooks · 11:51 PM

sorry for my spelling everyone

Katie Klabusich · 11:51 PM

Ha! Me too. :p

Michael Brooks · 11:51 PM

you haven't misspelled anything

Michael Brooks · 11:51 PM

you are solid!

Katie Klabusich · 11:51 PM

Earlier you mentioned that there will be movement in Congress to reinstate old and add new (ha! autocorrect!) sanctions.

Katie Klabusich · 11:52 PM

Should this be a call to action in the new year for people to let their legislators know they don't support new sanctions?

Michael Brooks · 11:52 PM

some people are pushing for it I thin for now Obama can probably work to hold that off but I would honestly call or email your rep and say let negotiations happen do not push for more sanctions

Michael Brooks · 11:53 PM

so for sure

Michael Brooks · 11:53 PM

call to action

Katie Klabusich · 11:53 PM

I dig this website: http://www.contactingthecongress.org

Katie Klabusich · 11:53 PM

You can put in your zip code and it'll give you email/twitter/phone/address everything you need.

Michael Brooks · 11:54 PM

and watch my takedown of the Iran Facts video and school anyone who mentions it or other nonsense regarding more sanctions

Katie Klabusich · 11:54 PM

I actually find twitter to be a fairly effective tool for this sort of thing because the feeds are monitored by diligent staffers a lot of the time.

Katie Klabusich · 11:54 PM

★ Spotlighted from Mitchell Heldt

“Sorry that I am late. Did we discuss ramifications of striking an operating weapons grade fuel production nuclear plant vs just a nuclear power plant?”

Michael Brooks · 11:54 PM

def

Michael Brooks · 11:54 PM

use Twitter for sure

Katie Klabusich · 11:54 PM

And YES, everyone should check out the video I gave the link to earlier.

Michael Brooks · 11:55 PM

and the public is pretty supportive of this

Michael Brooks · 11:55 PM

short term deal and continued negotiations

Michael Brooks · 11:55 PM

Not sure I can answer Mitchell's question well

Michael Brooks · 11:56 PM

but, i'm sure the fallout from some of these places would not be pretty at all-others are pretty fortified which makes them harder targets

Katie Klabusich · 11:57 PM

And a reason, I assume, why negotiations to reduce enrichment to energy-only levels is so important.

Michael Brooks · 11:57 PM

I think we Iran its better to Bob Marley it as best we can

Katie Klabusich · 11:57 PM

Here's the iTunes link to Michael's podcast, Intersection, before I forget: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/aslan-media-digital-dialogue/id746164884?mt=2

Katie Klabusich · 11:57 PM

So go subscribe! And follow him on twitter where he's a great mix of hip hop and foreign policy. ;)

Michael Brooks · 11:58 PM

lol

Michael Brooks · 11:58 PM

that's true

Katie Klabusich · 11:58 PM

★ Spotlighted from Mitchell Heldt

“The public does not even have a grasp of concepts of fusion or fission and think that Fukushima is a minor problem instead of just being tiny compared to a bomb strike on a weapon fuel production facility”

Michael Brooks · 11:58 PM

and domestic income inequality and opportunity stuff

Katie Klabusich · 11:58 PM

I'd assume "bomb strike" of anything would cause problems beyond just a nuclear reactor breaking down.

Katie Klabusich · 11:59 PM

Another reason to contact your reps and tell them not to support further sanctions; no need to push Iranian leadership into further development of nuclear technology.

Michael Brooks · 11:59 PM

the negotiations are working

Michael Brooks · 12:00 AM

i don't want Iran to have a nuclear weapon in fact I'm generally not a fan of nuclear energy but negotiation and understanding Iran's strategic viewpoint is the best way to get there

Katie Klabusich · 12:01 AM

Awesome! On that positive note, I think we're outta here!

Katie Klabusich · 12:01 AM

Thanks for coming -- and mostly listening. ;)

Michael Brooks · 12:01 AM

my pleasure

Michael Brooks · 12:01 AM

thank you Katie and thanks everyone!

Katie Klabusich · 12:01 AM

Hopefully Michael will come back in the Spring (before then, but definitely then) to update us on negotiations and the terms of the final deal.

Katie Klabusich · 12:01 AM

Have a good night, everyone!

Michael Brooks · 12:01 AM

oh for sure before

Michael Brooks · 12:01 AM

night everyone

Forum · 10

Forum· 10 comments

56 visitors

Tawkers AdminNov 30, 2013, 3:06 AM★ Spotlighted

Welcome to the Forum! To get involved, click "Who's Here" and FOLLOW others in the Tawk. Don't forget to "Like" comments, the Hosts only see the comments that get enough votes…

Tawkers AdminNov 30, 2013, 3:06 AM★ Spotlighted

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Jordan BirnbaumDec 4, 2013, 5:47 PM★ Spotlighted

If we ARE getting along, it's probably best not to mention that whole CIA-directed coup thing….

Jordan BirnbaumDec 4, 2013, 11:11 PM★ Spotlighted

What's the state of the Green Movement in Iran?

Mitchell HeldtDec 4, 2013, 11:54 PM★ Spotlighted

Sorry that I am late. Did we discuss ramifications of striking an operating weapons grade fuel production nuclear plant vs just a nuclear power plant?

Mitchell HeldtDec 4, 2013, 11:57 PM★ Spotlighted

The public does not even have a grasp of concepts of fusion or fission and think that Fukushima is a minor problem instead of just being tiny compared to a bomb strike on a weapon fuel production facility

Mitchell HeldtDec 4, 2013, 11:58 PM

Even the damage that a squirrel or jelly fish can have on a nuclear reactor was not taken into consideration for nuclear power plants in operation now

Mitchell HeldtDec 5, 2013, 12:00 AM

I will trade nuclear advice for foreign policy advice. Feel free to contact me.

Mitchell HeldtDec 5, 2013, 12:01 AM

Yes, I am scared of the complications of such a large percentage of our engineers with master's or doctorates being unemployed and broke.

Pouya RazJun 23, 2014, 2:31 AM

Ops