Blake Ian

Host

The Path of Mindfulness Meditation

Nov 6, 2013·54 visitors

Peter Strong

Cohost

Stage· 78 messages

Nov 6, 2013

A discussion with Dr. Peter Strong, a professional online mindfulness therapist, meditation teacher and author who treats anxiety, depression and all forms of emotional stress both in-person and online through Skype.

Blake Ian · 11:00 PM

Welcome Dr. Strong.

Peter Strong · 11:01 PM

Hi! Welcome to this discussion about mindfulness meditation - vipassana

Blake Ian · 11:01 PM

So I would like to touch on a few general points about your, during out time tonight

Blake Ian · 11:01 PM

Lets begin though with your book, The Path of Mindfulness Meditation

Blake Ian · 11:02 PM

Early on there was a line that I read a few times over (which I always consider a sign of a good book, and a good line!)

Blake Ian · 11:03 PM

"This inner guiding principle exists in all of us, but in order to do its job of healing and restoring balance, it must have freedom to operate..."

Blake Ian · 11:03 PM

referring to the state of Mindfulness

Peter Strong · 11:04 PM

That actually refers to out intuitive intelligence, called satipanna in Pali. This is what gets activated when we become mindful and free from reactivity.

Blake Ian · 11:05 PM

Right, what you define as “mindfulness-based wisdom-intelligence.”

Blake Ian · 11:06 PM

So I suppose my immediate question was "Why is this not our default as human adults"

Blake Ian · 11:06 PM

Making Rebecca's comment not so silly at all.

Blake Ian · 11:06 PM

★ Spotlighted from Rebecca Westbrook Toker

“I am, as yet, unable to achieve a meditative state. I don't know how to not think thoughts. I amuses me to no end that I think I need someone else to teach me how to meditate.”

Blake Ian · 11:06 PM

We need to LEARN or perhaps relearn this natural and very healthy state

Blake Ian · 11:06 PM

Why do you think that is?

Peter Strong · 11:08 PM

Panna and Buddha mind (bodhicitta) IS our defailt state. We simply lose connection with this through the accumulated identifications with mental content - habits, reactive emotions, thoughts, views and beliefs, etc.

Peter Strong · 11:10 PM

Meditation is NOT about not having thoughts; it is about changing our relationship to our thoughts from reactive identification, aversion and clinging to one of responsiveness based on freedom - the freedom of the unconditioned mind that we develop t

Blake Ian · 11:11 PM

Absolutely I have experienced that first hand during my practice of Transcendental Meditation

Blake Ian · 11:11 PM

People often ask me about meditating and almost always add in that they just don't think they could ever stop thinking...

Blake Ian · 11:12 PM

and I let them know I agree... you don't stop thinking. That would mean you were dead.

Blake Ian · 11:13 PM

So where do you think the root of these disruptive habits stem from?

Blake Ian · 11:13 PM

Society? Family? Trauma?

Blake Ian · 11:13 PM

Why do we all gravitate away from this healthier perspective

Peter Strong · 11:15 PM

This is also part of our constitution as a human being. We contain both the Conditioned ind and the Unconditioned Mind. Through unawareness we tend to become identified with form - thoughts, beliefs, behaviors, etc.

Peter Strong · 11:16 PM

As we develop mindfulness we start to shift our being from Conditioned Mind to Unconditioned Mind (bodhicitta).

Blake Ian · 11:16 PM

Ah, I have asked this question to many people and thats a really great answer! I can always get my head around the concept of balance.

Blake Ian · 11:16 PM

Cannot have one side without the other

Peter Strong · 11:18 PM

Exactly. We tend to, as meditators, get identified with the belief that we should not have thoughts; that they are the enemy. This is wrong practice...and it creates inner conflict, which is definitely NOT what the Buddha taught.

Blake Ian · 11:18 PM

Totally, and not what my TM teacher taught, luckily :)

Peter Strong · 11:19 PM

Mindfulness must incorporate compassion, appreciation and equinimity, collectively called metta. Mindfulness is NOT simply awareness. Mindfulness=Awareness+Metta

Blake Ian · 11:20 PM

Well there's another line I'll probably want to take a few passes at before moving on... haha

Blake Ian · 11:20 PM

If you don't mind let's take a look at Helene's question for a minute. Its funny but this has actually come up with me, three times this week in conversation.

Blake Ian · 11:20 PM

★ Spotlighted from Helene Paradis

“Any way I can avoid the fear that comes with slipping into the gap ?”

Blake Ian · 11:20 PM

★ Spotlighted from Jordan Birnbaum

“@helene what do you mean by "slipping into the gap?"”

Blake Ian · 11:21 PM

@Jordan I believe Helene is referring to some Deepak language... what he calls the gap, the space between thought

Blake Ian · 11:21 PM

As Alan Watts would say often, sound consists of sound and silence and everything in between

Blake Ian · 11:21 PM

So thought consists of thought and no thought

Blake Ian · 11:22 PM

but this point in particular about the fear that comes JUST came up in a conversation with my brother on TM (which he also practices) and then with my teacher last night

Blake Ian · 11:23 PM

Where we landed is that this is a deep stress coming undone and once you develop a more detached relationship to your thoughts, as Dr Strong has said, it is not a wall for you any longer

Blake Ian · 11:23 PM

Dr Strong do you have any thoughts on this?

Peter Strong · 11:25 PM

Yes. Mindfulness Meditation is about embracing our emotions, and especially our suffering, dukkha, because that keeps us stuck. Avoidance does not work; aversion does not heal, but mindfulness creates the right internal conditions (awareness+compassi

Peter Strong · 11:27 PM

awareness+ compassion, and THAT does bring about healing. Fear is nor the enemy, it is the way to connect with your True Self (another term for bodhicitta)

Peter Strong · 11:27 PM

Bodhicitta="awakened" "mind"

Blake Ian · 11:27 PM

Fun Fact: my dog is named "Bodhi" for that reason. :)

Blake Ian · 11:28 PM

But so true, and so essential to learn, that fear is not the enemy.

Blake Ian · 11:29 PM

It may be one of the predominant lessons throughout my early adult life.

Peter Strong · 11:30 PM

Yes, it is so important to build a mindfulness-based relationship with your emotions - and that includes positive as well as negative emotions. You must learn to love your fear, your anger, your pain, your sadness...This is what heals and transforms.

Blake Ian · 11:31 PM

★ Spotlighted from Helene Paradis

“Technically, I am not afraid or don't think I am... I just can't seem to get past a certain point without a feeling of fear... your thoughts on this please ?”

Blake Ian · 11:31 PM

What has helped me at this point is to just not react. Sit there with it and see what happens next.

Blake Ian · 11:32 PM

Dr Strong? Professional advice?

Blake Ian · 11:32 PM

★ Spotlighted from Jordan Birnbaum

“is willpower the path to overcoming fear?”

Peter Strong · 11:33 PM

The point is to turn towards your fear and embrace it. DONT try to get past it, rather let it heal itself in the soace of mindfulness that you create around it. Then it burns itself out rather like a fire will burn itself out if you dont feed it.

Peter Strong · 11:34 PM

Sit and meditate on the fear - make that the center of your meditation...It persists because it has never been respected and loved...

Blake Ian · 11:34 PM

Well said.

Blake Ian · 11:34 PM

You are no stranger to giving mental health advice online...

Blake Ian · 11:35 PM

Let's spend some time tawking about your practice of therapy sessions via Skype!

Blake Ian · 11:35 PM

first question... do you get royalties from Lisa Kudrow's show Web Therapy!?

Peter Strong · 11:35 PM

If only!

Blake Ian · 11:36 PM

OK first REAL question. Is it always Video? Face to Face

Peter Strong · 11:37 PM

Skype video calls are in my experience just as effective if not more effective than in-person, because client feels more comfortable, in control and less intimidated by the clinical environment often associated with a therapist's office.

Blake Ian · 11:38 PM

Well that was my next question... In two parts. What do you lose and what do you gain?

Blake Ian · 11:39 PM

For sure that makes a lot of sense that a client may feel more comfortable, less inhibited

Blake Ian · 11:39 PM

In fact its something we consider all the time while building Tawkers.

Blake Ian · 11:40 PM

No lights, no make up and production. Just sitting comfortably on a couch anywhere in the world and conducting an interview or panel discussion.

Blake Ian · 11:40 PM

anything you feel that is lost with the Skype Sessions compared to in person?

Blake Ian · 11:41 PM

★ Spotlighted from Jordan Birnbaum

“that's interesting. someone should do a study on that effect, Dr. Strong.”

Peter Strong · 11:41 PM

No. Remember, "therapy" is a collective term and includes many different approaches. Some styles depend on developing a therapist-client relationship; Mindfulness Therapy does not...

Blake Ian · 11:42 PM

Ah I see.

Blake Ian · 11:42 PM

The right tool for the right job

Peter Strong · 11:43 PM

There have been studies comparing the relative effectiveness of CBT in-person or online, and the results support my experience.

Blake Ian · 11:43 PM

Well I certainly look forward to digging in and learning more.

Blake Ian · 11:43 PM

I know we have nay a few minutes left here of your time... Where can people learn more about your practice?

Blake Ian · 11:44 PM

Also everyone check out the book, it's available in paperback and on Kindle which is how I am reading. (on the iPad app of course)

Blake Ian · 11:44 PM

http://www.amazon.com/Path-Mindfulness-Meditation-Peter-Strong/dp/1432736884

Peter Strong · 11:46 PM

Please visit my website, http://www.counselingtherapyonline.com and feel free to email me to ask your questions about online mindfulness therapy and to schedule a Skype session. This approach is wonderful for anxiety disorders and depression...

Blake Ian · 11:47 PM

Excellent. Well Thanks for the time and the Tawk Dr. Strong. We should do this again!

Peter Strong · 11:47 PM

It was a pleasure!

Blake Ian · 11:47 PM

Thanks everyone for your questions and for the shy ones who like to just read along. Hope it was helpful!

Blake Ian · 11:47 PM

Be well

Forum · 22

Forum· 22 comments

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Rebecca Westbrook TokerNov 6, 2013, 8:15 PM★ Spotlighted

I am, as yet, unable to achieve a meditative state. I don't know how to not think thoughts. I amuses me to no end that I think I need someone else to teach me how to meditate.

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 10:59 PM

anxiety and depression?! this Tawk was MADE for me!

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:04 PM

That statement implies we are often our own worse enemies. Sadly, I agree.

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:08 PM

what precludes us from being able to access both the intuitive and the practical?

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:10 PM

wouldn't our experience of the practical be so much happier if we could exist in both states simultaneously.

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:13 PM

well, death does seem peaceful...

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:15 PM★ Spotlighted

Any way I can avoid the fear that comes with slipping into the gap ?

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:16 PM★ Spotlighted

@helene what do you mean by "slipping into the gap?"

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:17 PM

like heading into the unknown?

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:21 PM

The space in between your thoughts...

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:22 PM

Yes, that Gap. Why do I find myself afraid to go deeper ?

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:29 PM★ Spotlighted

Technically, I am not afraid or don't think I am... I just can't seem to get past a certain point without a feeling of fear... your thoughts on this please ?

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:30 PM

what happens when one is stuck in a del depression? is he feeling his pain or avoiding it?

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:32 PM★ Spotlighted

is willpower the path to overcoming fear?

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:34 PM

Thank - You Ian, I will work on this... or rather, sit with this. lol So, a block is what this is ?

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:39 PM★ Spotlighted

that's interesting. someone should do a study on that effect, Dr. Strong.

Rebecca Westbrook TokerNov 6, 2013, 11:43 PM

Just got here! Sorry to miss so much!

Jordan BirnbaumNov 6, 2013, 11:43 PM

hey becca!

Helene ParadisNov 6, 2013, 11:48 PM

Many Thanks...

Kit NowellNov 7, 2013, 4:06 PM

sorry i missed this -- was at a mindfulness class on kindness and acceptance. will definitely check out dr strong’s book!