Lee Camp

Host

Whistleblowers & Whistle Blow Jobs

Nov 26, 2013·264 visitors

Eleanor Goldfield

Cohost

Stage· 219 messages

Nov 26, 2013

Are whistleblowers traitors? Or are they the last gasp of our free society?

Lee Camp · 3:43 PM

★ Spotlighted from Tawkers Admin

“Did you know that you can share this Tawk by clicking the Share button just under the search in the top right? Give it a try and let people know there's a Tawk happening!”

Lee Camp · 9:00 PM

Welcome everybody!

Lee Camp · 9:00 PM

Thanks for co-hosting Eleanor!

Lee Camp · 9:00 PM

Hopefully this will be the first of several weekly Moment of Clarity Tawks.

Lee Camp · 9:01 PM

By the way, for everybody in the "audience" you have to click the thumbs up on comments you like for Eleanor and I to see them.

Lee Camp · 9:01 PM

Okay, enough of that shit. Let's start as the devil's advocate - whistle blowers are law breakers, right?

Lee Camp · 9:01 PM

★ Spotlighted from Dennis Mudloff

“Whistleblowers are our last hope for truth. The corporate controlled media covers up more Truth than they report.”

Lee Camp · 9:01 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“That our society finds nudity more shocking than intrusive spying on its citizenry is terrifying to me.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:01 PM

Sorry - my computer had a moment.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:02 PM

Katie and I spoke a bit about this subject yesterday. Exposure in any form seems a frightening thought, whether that be a naked body or "state secrets."

Lee Camp · 9:02 PM

I think the response to people who say whistle blowers are law breakers or traitors is that the law they are breaking is minuscule in comparison to the criminality they're revealing.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:02 PM

Very true.

Lee Camp · 9:03 PM

It's kinda like jay-walking in order to tackle someone punting a baby.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:03 PM

Hahaha

Lee Camp · 9:03 PM

★ Spotlighted from Cathy Cubilla

“I agree with Craig K. Down to the tiniest communities there is punishment for saying "hey, isn't that unethical, or, illegal?”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:03 PM

The question then becomes how to shift this paradigm.

Lee Camp · 9:04 PM

★ Spotlighted from jovanni van wijnendaele

“if I said to my boss and the whole twitter-sphere that his shit stinks, I'll think I'd be on the look out for a new job. And I would be considered a traitor by the people who were once my collegues. They'd be convincing my former boss his shit doesn'”

Lee Camp · 9:04 PM

★ Spotlighted from jovanni van wijnendaele

“***doesn't stink but smells like roses.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:04 PM

This morning I read that it will now be necessary to pay $5000 to protest oil drilling.

Lee Camp · 9:04 PM

Well, Jovanni, it would have to do with what level of crime you're revealing.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:04 PM

It's becoming more and more difficult and of course, illegal to expose or protest wrongdoings.

Lee Camp · 9:04 PM

@EG Yeah, I saw that. It's fucking bullshit. it's the continued criminalizing of protest.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:05 PM

Absolutely. So of course, because of this, it becomes even more important to expose and protest

Lee Camp · 9:06 PM

Part of this has to do with the advances in technology - it means there are a lot more secrets and a whole lot more worry by the ruling elite that those secrets won't be protected

Lee Camp · 9:06 PM

Obama has prosecuted twice as many whistle blowers than all the presidents before him combined.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:06 PM

Absolutely. That's why SOPA and PIPA were so important. If it weren't for the TPP leak, we'd still be in the dark regarding the scope of that insidious deal.

Lee Camp · 9:06 PM

★ Spotlighted from kimba kradel

“I think that part of the whistleblowing "problem" is that every corporation, and every form of government, has some scary skeletons in their closets.”

Lee Camp · 9:07 PM

TPP is truly horrible. I've been doing videos about it for a year now. It's amazing people don't know.

Lee Camp · 9:07 PM

As Chomsky says - trade deals are designed to minimize the "risk" of democracy for corporate interests.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:07 PM

Very true. And I don't need to know about all of them, but when corporations run governments and governments are charged with running my socio-political life, I wanna know what the hell they're up to!

Lee Camp · 9:08 PM

Corporations hate democracy, so trade deals allow them to hammer things in place without worrying about whether the people stand up or protest.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:08 PM

★ Spotlighted from Helen InCarp

“The mainstream media has covered whistleblowers badly, they barely even covered Chelsea Mannings trial yet benefitted hugely thru the data. Wondering if Lee has any specific pet peeves on MSM coverage of WBs.”

Lee Camp · 9:09 PM

[Quick note - if everybody here could post on FB that they're here with the link, hopefully we can grab even more people into this discussion.]

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:09 PM

With less regulation, they won't even need to cover things up anymore. Atrocities against constituents will be legal.

Lee Camp · 9:09 PM

@Helen - The corporate media's job is crush whistle blowers and crush the idea of speaking out against the status quo.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:10 PM

I can't speak for Lee but personally I wasn't expecting much out of the corporate media. People should boycott that just as much as they do Wal-Mart

Lee Camp · 9:10 PM

And as I've said in my stand-up, freaking out about Snowden because he's a "traitor" or because he "failed out of college" is like someone telling you your house is on fire and then you ignore them because they failed out of college.

Lee Camp · 9:10 PM

You can speak for me anytime, EG

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:10 PM

It's the same thing with Assange and rape allegations in Sweden

Lee Camp · 9:11 PM

★ Spotlighted from C.j. Park

“Innocent American mothers whistleblow on child abusers/molesters and are punished, put in prison, and have their precious children placed with the actual identified abuser.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:11 PM

I'll quote you on that

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:11 PM

Good point, C.J. It happens at every level of society

Lee Camp · 9:11 PM

Well, and even if the allegations of "tearing the condom" were true, it would have nothing to do with the info from Wikileaks.

Lee Camp · 9:12 PM

It's a complete diversion.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:12 PM

Interestingly enough, with the Assange "sexual assault" that took place in Sweden

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:12 PM

the swedish press reported initially that nothing happened

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:12 PM

that was quickly revoked and a very sterile report was made that he did indeed rape this woman

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:12 PM

as if someone had forced the Swedish press to print it

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:12 PM

I was in Sweden at the time, and I have a few friends in media there. They just shook their heads in shame

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:13 PM

It wasn't even a very good framing!

Lee Camp · 9:13 PM

And if I'm correct, didn't the swedish prosecutor never even claim that Assange had to come back to Sweden?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:13 PM

The whole story is totally full of holes - no pun intended

Lee Camp · 9:13 PM

Anyway, I suppose that's losing the thread.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:13 PM

Yeah, sorry. Got carried away again

Lee Camp · 9:13 PM

HA! full of holes!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:13 PM

At least I'm spelling things correctly as of right now

Lee Camp · 9:14 PM

@Helen - Sorry I didn't answer you. I have a million pet peeves with the MSM. At the end of the day, they're a corporate entity and they're selling something to big business - they're selling audience.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:14 PM

Anyway, getting back to it - whistleblowing was originally supposed to be a way to bring issues to light that were illegal or unjust, from child abuse to the TPP

Lee Camp · 9:14 PM

They don't have a huge interest in getting the story right.

Lee Camp · 9:15 PM

As with boston bombing, which they got completely wrong for several days - it was their highest ratings in years!

Lee Camp · 9:15 PM

So it doesn't matter if they do it right.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:15 PM

Now it's seen as an act of treason. Question: does anyone remember whistleblowing being presented in a positive or patriotic light?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:16 PM

I'll take that as a no :)

Lee Camp · 9:16 PM

Seriously, it should be viewed as a bold and heroic move.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:17 PM

I certainly don't. Although I think you could probably parallel that to the rise of neo-cons in the early 70s, which lines up with a rise in apathy

Lee Camp · 9:17 PM

I mean, Snowden truly gave up his life. Chelsea Manning gave up hers, but I don't think she knew that would be the result.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:17 PM

The more crackdown there is on whistleblowers, the more people will likely step away from speaking out.

Lee Camp · 9:17 PM

I also think it has to do with the death of unions - the workers are the ones who would view WB-ing as important.

Lee Camp · 9:18 PM

And without workers having power, they can't WB on their bosses or their corporations.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:18 PM

Without power and without any support from national media

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:19 PM

People were more interested in the fact that it was now "Chelsea" as opposed to what she exposed

Lee Camp · 9:19 PM

Let's go back to the TPP for a minute. It does look like the Trans-Pacific Partnership is facing some trouble (finally)!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:20 PM

Yes! I would encourage everyone to check out exposethetpp.org

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:20 PM

It's a great site with a wealth of information

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:20 PM

Including step by step suggestions on how to become an active part of the movement to stop the TPP

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:21 PM

Lee and my band's show will be partnering with that site to support this exposure and fight

Lee Camp · 9:21 PM

And not only is there the secretive TPP, there's also TTIP, which is for the Euro Zone and the US

Lee Camp · 9:21 PM

(We're doing a show together in LA on Dec 13 & 14th - details at LeeCamp.net/schedule )

Lee Camp · 9:22 PM

It's pretty obvious that the more people know about TPP, the more they hate it.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:22 PM

Got this message from Katie:

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:22 PM

Daniel Ellsberg and the pentagon papers are viewed positively now, but he was demonized at the time. We are very short sighted as a society; it takes us time to understand the importance of patriotic acts.

Lee Camp · 9:22 PM

And I think it's tough for Obama supporters to understand why he would do this - but I argue it's because he's a corporate employee, and it's what they want.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:23 PM

That brings up a good point. We have very short memories and even shorter attention spans.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:23 PM

I personally can't understand why anyone would support Obama at this juncture

Lee Camp · 9:23 PM

Do you think maybe it's because there is no longer the media propaganda push against Ellsberg?

Lee Camp · 9:23 PM

Once that push dies down, people start to come back over to the more accurate opinion.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:24 PM

or do they just forget?

Lee Camp · 9:24 PM

they meaning america? Or they meaning media?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:24 PM

America

Lee Camp · 9:24 PM

How can they remember when Miley Cyrus is performing with a giant kitten??

Lee Camp · 9:25 PM

It's like a lobotomy for the nation!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:25 PM

You know what Lee - I'm gonna have to throw something at you for bringing that up again

Lee Camp · 9:25 PM

★ Spotlighted from Nikky Starrs

“Lee, I've been calling in sick to work very frequently for the past 2 years. I feel extreme anxiety when entering my workplace (a bank) because i feel guilty for just going along with the other slaves. My shrink's advice was essentially:”

Lee Camp · 9:25 PM

★ Spotlighted from Nikky Starrs

“"bite the bullet, everyone has to work" but I just cant cope with this or participate, any advice for me?”

Lee Camp · 9:25 PM

@Nikky - While maintaining your job, are you able to find other activities/jobs/hobbies that are more fulfilling? And maybe you can one day make a living from them?

Lee Camp · 9:26 PM

Far be it from me to tell someone to quit their job - I know I'm very lucky to be able to do what I love for a career. I realize that's rare. But i think it's important to make sure the job you hate is not your life. Life is so fleeting - you

Lee Camp · 9:27 PM

must find a way to make it meaningful.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:27 PM

@Nikky, everyone has to work and our current economy doesn't allow people to pick and choose often. Just because you work for a bank doesn't mean that you can't find activism through passions outside of the workplace

Lee Camp · 9:27 PM

@Nikky - If you responded to me, I can't see it. Perhaps people in the room didn't give it a thumbs up? [Arrgh!]

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:28 PM

I'm an activist but I still have a Mac computer. We are a part of society even if we fight against facets of it

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:28 PM

I used to have a Bank of America account.

Lee Camp · 9:28 PM

You have a Mac!! You WHORE!!

Lee Camp · 9:28 PM

(kidding)

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:28 PM

Now I don't. Making small changes is an act of dissension

Lee Camp · 9:29 PM

Yeah, I used to have a Chase account before Occupy started.

Lee Camp · 9:29 PM

Small decisions are crucial. And plus, Nikky, it's possible that your "bad attitude" could make some of your colleagues think and question how they blindly follow. You may be having an impact you don't notice.

Lee Camp · 9:30 PM

EG - Have you had jobs you hated?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:30 PM

I've been really lucky actually

Lee Camp · 9:30 PM

When I first started comedy I was a temp fro some awful consulting group. Luckily not for long.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:30 PM

I was a bit of an entrepeneur of sorts in college

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:30 PM

And when I moved to LA, I went straight into studios

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:31 PM

But working in the entertainment industry isn't always fun and entertaining

Lee Camp · 9:31 PM

I thought you told me you wrote commercials for ExxonMobil?

Lee Camp · 9:31 PM

(kidding again)

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:31 PM

It can be a real soul sucking, vapid parade at times

Lee Camp · 9:31 PM

Did you choreograph that Miley Cyrus kitten number?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:31 PM

Lee...

Lee Camp · 9:31 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“Eleanor and Lee -- you both make good points (re: Mac and bank accounts). We have to be as good as we can and as consistent as we can. We're never going to be perfect. I still need my Mac, but moved my money to a local bank.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:32 PM

Exactly

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:32 PM

I could pull a Zarathustra and go live in the mountains

Lee Camp · 9:32 PM

I've done rants before about small acts. They're crucial.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:32 PM

But it's more effective, as an activist, to be amongst the fray

Lee Camp · 9:32 PM

Oh yeah, it's also tattooed on my arm. I forgot.

Lee Camp · 9:32 PM

Maybe that's why I put it there.

Lee Camp · 9:32 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“If I were going to be perfect, I'd have to do without coffee to-go. // E--but would you be able to work to change society by running from it?”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:33 PM

@Katie - I don't think so, not personally

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:33 PM

that's one of the reasons I haven't moved to sweden

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:33 PM

I really want to but I can't be as effective from far away.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:33 PM

It's a bit like a politician can't be as effective if they don't know what it's like to be a regular citizen

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:33 PM

Case in point...today's Congress

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:34 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“(No one wants to see me without coffee, btw) I think having to participate in some of society's "ills" is the cognitive dissonance we have to get ok with to change this place. Or we're Eleanor & I will have to start a line of naked protest calendars.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:34 PM

Katie...I would totally buy that calendar

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:34 PM

Like 10 of them

Lee Camp · 9:34 PM

To broaden things a little - are you hopeful that things like Wikileaks are inevitable and will continue to grow and will hold corporate entities accountable?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:34 PM

And yes Katie, I absolutely agree.

Lee Camp · 9:35 PM

yay naked calendars!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:35 PM

As for Wikileaks, I like to think that it has pushed people to be more active

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:35 PM

A lot of people need to see that the ball is rolling, and I really think it is

Lee Camp · 9:35 PM

If we manage to keep the internet relatively free, it could continue to facilitate a mental revolution

Lee Camp · 9:35 PM

A revolution of thought and information.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:36 PM

Again, alternative media needs to hi-light these stories and reach a wider audience

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:36 PM

And that can be delivered through entertaining mediums

Lee Camp · 9:36 PM

Like... say... comedy and music?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:36 PM

That's why I think the artistic activism section on expose the TPP is so great

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:36 PM

....good idea, Lee!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:37 PM

I made this point in the interview I did for SOMA Magazine that's out now - knowledge is the catalyst for change, but that doesn't mean it has to be presented in a boring way

Lee Camp · 9:37 PM

Yeah, as I've said before - boring evil is the worst kind! Boring evil kicks ass because no pays attention

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:37 PM

exactly

Lee Camp · 9:38 PM

If anyone wants to see my comedy episode on the TPP, it's here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M1o7bPNOGo (Wait until after the Tawk!)

Lee Camp · 9:38 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“Look at that -- the internet can make even Lee a bit rosy and enthusiastic. (I sound like fucking Pollyanna when I talk about the possibilities.) Yes, interesting is key. That's why as many people with art and something to say have to start yelling.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:38 PM

It's the job of creative people to do so

Lee Camp · 9:38 PM

Body paint.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:38 PM

Whistleblowers combined with artists (who are the voices of a generation) are a tremendous force

Lee Camp · 9:39 PM

That's why we gotta set up this joint tour, right EG?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:39 PM

Hells bells, we are! You may have to share a bed with one of my band mates, but I think only two of them snore ;)

Lee Camp · 9:40 PM

I found an answer to the snoring - it involves a marine and a muslim woman - http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/20131122/times-square-theater-district/ad-showing-us-soldier-embracing-muslim-woman-nixed-times-sq-firm-says

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:40 PM

Yeah, I saw that!

Lee Camp · 9:41 PM

But the most amazing thing about the TPP stuff leaked by Wikileaks is that we have truly gotten to the point that in order for our republic to operate with anything resembling consent

Lee Camp · 9:41 PM

we need to get our information from organizations that our government considers terrorist!

Lee Camp · 9:41 PM

How fucking ridiculous is that>?!

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:41 PM

Yeah, that is pretty damn twisted

Lee Camp · 9:42 PM

Democracy can only exist with an INFORMED citizenry.

Lee Camp · 9:42 PM

How can we be informed when the largest trade deals in mankind's history are not revealed to us??

Lee Camp · 9:42 PM

And the largest surveillance infrastructure in mankind's history is not revealed to us??

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:43 PM

Here's a question: is it more the job of the citizenry to educate themselves or should there be avenues in place, such as media, to make that happen?

Lee Camp · 9:43 PM

It's fucking offensive on every level! People should be fucking furious ...but they aren't.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:43 PM

I think what this country currently has is a dangerous blend of ignorance and arrogance

Lee Camp · 9:43 PM

It's both I guess. An ideal citizen informs themselves. An ideal media informs the people.

Lee Camp · 9:43 PM

and apathy.

Lee Camp · 9:43 PM

and Duck Dynasty.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:43 PM

I recently read a piece written by a woman with two jobs, three kids and a full coarse load

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:44 PM

Reading her story, I was reminded of a similar discussion with a woman at a soup kitchen here in LA

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:44 PM

She said she would help out other people if she could but how can she?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:45 PM

The system is set up so that people don't have the time, money or ability to be active, even on a local level

Lee Camp · 9:45 PM

[We have 10 mins left if anyone has remaining questions.]

Lee Camp · 9:45 PM

Yeah, it's debt slavery and wage slavery.

Lee Camp · 9:45 PM

What was that report called in the 70's "The crisis of democracy"

Lee Camp · 9:46 PM

The hippies scared the shit out of the ruling elite and they've made sure there wasn't that much free time ever since.

Lee Camp · 9:46 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“It should be the job of the rest of us to get active and drag our neighbors into participation alongside us -- wake up the people watching Duck Dynasty. Those people have time to march.”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:46 PM

The question that @Nikky asked is similar. But if you have the time, and it clearly weighs on your conscience, then you have the ability to do something, anything, small.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:47 PM

Absolutely. I will happily march for that woman in the soup kitchen. For the Duck Dynasty people (is that a show? I'm out of the loop), bring your ducks to the march too

Lee Camp · 9:47 PM

Every day we make hundreds of decisions that could be baby steps toward a better civilization, molecules that make up a societal elevation...

Lee Camp · 9:47 PM

and a billion people across the globe think to themselves "those things don't matter at all."

Lee Camp · 9:47 PM

So pause and think "What if ALL those people thought they did matter?"

Lee Camp · 9:48 PM

Each one of those decisions every day is a statement that contagious passion matters more than ironic detachment.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:48 PM

yep. a drop in the bucket isn't much but you take a billion drops, that's a full bucket

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:48 PM

That's a great and poetic way of putting it, Lee

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:49 PM

B/c passion like that really is contagious.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:49 PM

Just like apathy is

Lee Camp · 9:49 PM

Oh, quick question bfore we wrap up - we have black friday coming up...

Lee Camp · 9:49 PM

I posted that it should be National Prank Corporations Day - and I gave some examples.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:49 PM

Absolutely behind that idea!

Lee Camp · 9:49 PM

I got several pieces of hate mail from people furious at me for recommending pranking businesses.

Lee Camp · 9:50 PM

They told me I was an elitist who was making the job harder for average workers.

Lee Camp · 9:50 PM

(Things like putting a "buy one get one free" sign on merchandise even when it's not.)

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:51 PM

Anything that will make people think about corporate capitalism is a good thing

Lee Camp · 9:51 PM

But my response was that the walmart strikers last year made the job harder for the non-strikers, but that doesn't mean it wasn't worth it.

Lee Camp · 9:51 PM

They drew attention to the plight of workers.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:51 PM

Your bit with the information cards was great, Lee

Lee Camp · 9:51 PM

Thanks. I'll post that link in asecond.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:51 PM

Here's a link for taking action against the TPP

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:51 PM

http://www.exposethetpp.org/TakeAction3.html

Lee Camp · 9:52 PM

Here's the video of me pranking sweatshop stores, if anyone wants to see it later - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOQtEb5zhxc

Lee Camp · 9:52 PM

So EG, I'm not an elitist?

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:52 PM

Ha - in that case, I'm even worse. I am, after all, a wino

Lee Camp · 9:53 PM

Ha. Have to switch back and forth between the wine and the latte.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:53 PM

Having the latte now. Wine o'clock soon tho :)

Lee Camp · 9:54 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“Now THAT is a sentiment to take to Thanksgiving dinner with the right-wing relatives. "What if you -- and everyone -- did something once a week that mattered?"”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:54 PM

Amen

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:54 PM

I'm giving my family money stamps for christmas

Lee Camp · 9:54 PM

Well, let's wrap up. Thanks for joining me, Eleanor! Thanks for sticking around, Katie. For those who don't know, Eleanor is the lead in an amazing band and she and I are doing a comedy & rock show in LA

Lee Camp · 9:54 PM

★ Spotlighted from Katie Klabusich

“What are Money Stamps???”

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:55 PM

stampstampede.org

Lee Camp · 9:55 PM

Our show is Dec 13 & 14. Details and tix here - http://www.brownpapertickets.com/event/518092

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:55 PM

Thanks everyone for being a part of this tawk!

Lee Camp · 9:56 PM

Thanks y'all! Let's do this every week! Tell your friends.

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:56 PM

Ha, you are from the south

Lee Camp · 9:56 PM

Oh, and here's today's moment of clarity video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-NgCQPN5ws

Eleanor Goldfield · 9:56 PM

See everyone next time!

Forum · 74

Forum· 74 comments

264 visitors

Tawkers AdminNov 25, 2013, 9:39 PM

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Tawkers AdminNov 25, 2013, 9:40 PM★ Spotlighted

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Craig KNov 25, 2013, 11:46 PM

Free society is an illusion. If we were free, we wouldn't face still penalties for whistle blowing. To the contrary, whistle blowing would be encouraged and admired.

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 4:46 PM★ Spotlighted

That our society finds nudity more shocking than intrusive spying on its citizenry is terrifying to me.

Dennis MudloffNov 26, 2013, 7:59 PM★ Spotlighted

Whistleblowers are our last hope for truth. The corporate controlled media covers up more Truth than they report.

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 8:13 PM★ Spotlighted

I agree with Craig K. Down to the tiniest communities there is punishment for saying "hey, isn't that unethical, or, illegal?

jovanni van wijnendaeleNov 26, 2013, 8:25 PM★ Spotlighted

if I said to my boss and the whole twitter-sphere that his shit stinks, I'll think I'd be on the look out for a new job. And I would be considered a traitor by the people who were once my collegues. They'd be convincing my former boss his shit doesn'

jovanni van wijnendaeleNov 26, 2013, 8:27 PM★ Spotlighted

***doesn't stink but smells like roses.

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:00 PM

afternoon/evening you two

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:05 PM

if people started to realise,and it was more common in conversation,that this stuff really does go on - every damn day. then may,justmaybe,things might change. and people might start to think different

tom allenNov 26, 2013, 9:05 PM

Howdy Lee, what role do you feel hackers aka "hacktivism" has in and around the movement.

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:05 PM★ Spotlighted

I think that part of the whistleblowing "problem" is that every corporation, and every form of government, has some scary skeletons in their closets.

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:06 PM

until you make whats going on common knowledge and not make it something that is thought of as "different",you aint gonna change how people feel about whistle blowers

Helen InCarpNov 26, 2013, 9:07 PM★ Spotlighted

The mainstream media has covered whistleblowers badly, they barely even covered Chelsea Mannings trial yet benefitted hugely thru the data. Wondering if Lee has any specific pet peeves on MSM coverage of WBs.

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:07 PM

btw guys -click those thumbs up or the comments wont be seen by lee or eleanor

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:08 PM

helen,you've obviously not seen Lee's videos.

C.j. ParkNov 26, 2013, 9:09 PM★ Spotlighted

Innocent American mothers whistleblow on child abusers/molesters and are punished, put in prison, and have their precious children placed with the actual identified abuser.

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:10 PM

I posted and asked people to come, who wants to think, isn't it time to be shopping or something?

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:10 PM

@cathy - most people do,sadly. they just dont wanna know about the bad things in life

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:10 PM

I get all my news by word-of-mouth.

tom allenNov 26, 2013, 9:11 PM

Damn, no love.

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:13 PM

I am all for whistleblowers, I think they are heroes - but does the vilification go back to "tattletale culture"? Are we still in elementary school as a society?

LeaAnn JohnsonNov 26, 2013, 9:14 PM

Fuck rank and file adherence to their laws. Civil disobedience is the only way out of this. What WBs do is revolutionary!

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:14 PM

Holey moley!

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:14 PM

HI Lee, big fan. I'

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:15 PM★ Spotlighted

Lee, I've been calling in sick to work very frequently for the past 2 years. I feel extreme anxiety when entering my workplace (a bank) because i feel guilty for just going along with the other slaves. My shrink's advice was essentially:

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:16 PM★ Spotlighted

"bite the bullet, everyone has to work" but I just cant cope with this or participate, any advice for me?

jovanni van wijnendaeleNov 26, 2013, 9:16 PM

yes ,football or whatever is the most popular sport in your country will be what's on the news all the time

Lucy DyerNov 26, 2013, 9:17 PM

have fun guys! see ya later :-)

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:17 PM

Thinking ... positive ... thoughts ... no, can't think of anyone ...

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:18 PM

I recall a co-worker asking me if I really wanted to be a "Joan of Arc" when I persisted in being astonished at some things I can't discuss. LOL

C.j. ParkNov 26, 2013, 9:18 PM

Please watch how 5 police officers broke in and kidnapped a baby from an innocent family...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr1lD0CwpBU

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:20 PM

I think the more people find out about the TPP the resistance it will face ...

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:20 PM

Can someone plz give my comments, thumbs up, I think thats the only way Lee can see my comments.

Dennis MudloffNov 26, 2013, 9:22 PM

Why do people continue to blow the whistle when it has been so costly for those who have done so before them? Do you think the punishment hinders or spurs future whistleblowers?

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:25 PM

Oh, Nikky, I'm so sorry, hang in there, not easy, I know.

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:26 PM

It is hard to come home with anything left at all for anything else, sadly.

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:27 PM

Nikky - maybe you could set aside a bit of your income and funnel it into worthwhile projects?

Michael GoodwinNov 26, 2013, 9:28 PM

@Lee Camp and Eleanor Goldfield

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:29 PM

The best thing we can do is live the best life, and honest life, possible.

Marty HahnNov 26, 2013, 9:29 PM

No, they are law questioners

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:29 PM

Thanks for the response. I relate to the saying "what if there was a war and nobody showed up" .. So I feel guilty because I feel I am participating therefore am part of the problem. I believe you're right, thank you for the advice.

Michael GoodwinNov 26, 2013, 9:30 PM

@ Lee Camp and Eleanor Goldfield, I think some people are having scrolling down to the most recent comments if you aren't using the right browser. I had to switch from Chrome to Firefox. FYI.

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:30 PM

Nikky? Lee was wondering if you saw him answer you?

Dan ChynowethNov 26, 2013, 9:30 PM

Yes it is called seed planting

Marty HahnNov 26, 2013, 9:30 PM

Is it morally right to obey an unjust law?

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:30 PM

We are a part of society, even if we fight facets of it - this is great

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:31 PM★ Spotlighted

Eleanor and Lee -- you both make good points (re: Mac and bank accounts). We have to be as good as we can and as consistent as we can. We're never going to be perfect. I still need my Mac, but moved my money to a local bank.

melissa kesslerNov 26, 2013, 9:32 PM

Do either of you have any suggestions or links that could give working (aka busy) people an idea of how they can help? most of us have very little money to donate and can't afford jail time for 1 reason or another. what are some of the small things w

melissa kesslerNov 26, 2013, 9:32 PM

e can do?

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:32 PM★ Spotlighted

If I were going to be perfect, I'd have to do without coffee to-go. // E--but would you be able to work to change society by running from it?

kimba kradelNov 26, 2013, 9:33 PM

I think there is a way to keep our toys and still move into a more honest and enlightened future. Not sure of the details, but I think it could be done ...

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:33 PM

I guess I'm just scared because I feel the system is unjust and I'm afraid I'm going to be on the wrong end of an injustice, so I withdraw, out of fear of prosecution for my "radical" beliefs

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:34 PM★ Spotlighted

(No one wants to see me without coffee, btw) I think having to participate in some of society's "ills" is the cognitive dissonance we have to get ok with to change this place. Or we're Eleanor & I will have to start a line of naked protest calendars.

Nikky StarrsNov 26, 2013, 9:34 PM

@Katie, good point. How can we hope to change anything by refusing to participate..

Cathy CubillaNov 26, 2013, 9:35 PM

Sure, naked women are going to change society, look how it's worked so far.

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:38 PM★ Spotlighted

Look at that -- the internet can make even Lee a bit rosy and enthusiastic. (I sound like fucking Pollyanna when I talk about the possibilities.) Yes, interesting is key. That's why as many people with art and something to say have to start yelling.

Michael GoodwinNov 26, 2013, 9:38 PM

Everyone should check out Lee's MOC video on the TPP: http://youtu.be/3M1o7bPNOGo

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:38 PM

Body paint and calendars. With protest dates. And treaty ratification alerts….

Helen InCarpNov 26, 2013, 9:41 PM

Yes the tp

Helen InCarpNov 26, 2013, 9:42 PM

Yes the TTP, if it were being done for the people we would have been kept up to date on its content, it was done in secrecy because it sucks for everyone but big business.

Dan ChynowethNov 26, 2013, 9:43 PM

It is time to stop believing and start thinking language and words are powerfull. Check out John Trudell I am Crazy on Youtube.

melissa kesslerNov 26, 2013, 9:44 PM

If you guys do a tour, you have to come to denver.

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:45 PM

@E you're describing the group I consider "exempt from participation" in our society. If you don't know where you kid's next meal is coming from or you work 90+ hrs/week, you don't have time or energy. (Been there)

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:46 PM★ Spotlighted

It should be the job of the rest of us to get active and drag our neighbors into participation alongside us -- wake up the people watching Duck Dynasty. Those people have time to march.

melissa kesslerNov 26, 2013, 9:48 PM

how do we make those decisions correctly?

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:48 PM★ Spotlighted

Now THAT is a sentiment to take to Thanksgiving dinner with the right-wing relatives. "What if you -- and everyone -- did something once a week that mattered?"

melissa kesslerNov 26, 2013, 9:50 PM

businesses are pranking us daily!!

Dan ChynowethNov 26, 2013, 9:51 PM

Go in to walmart with a bunch of people and fill carts up and then just wander away from them.

Mike GoodNov 26, 2013, 9:51 PM

No Lee it should be ridiculous shit like Buy One get Seven for Free.

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:54 PM★ Spotlighted

What are Money Stamps???

Mike GoodNov 26, 2013, 9:56 PM

Bye!

Michael GoodwinNov 26, 2013, 9:56 PM

Bye!

Katie KlabusichNov 26, 2013, 9:57 PM

Thanks for doing this topic!